Stupid Auburn playing on Thursday SEC Picks

Home teams in ugly, ugly orange

Alabama 79, Tennessee i
WVU 18, Auburn 17
Florida 37, Kentucky 12
Vandy 22, Duke 17
Georgia 28, LSU 24
Ole Miss 30, Arkansas 20
MSU 17, MTSU 14

171 thoughts on “Stupid Auburn playing on Thursday SEC Picks”

  1. is WVU’s AD so lazy that he just didnt want to go through the hiring process? You cant make me believe that Bill Stewart was a good hire in any way. He’s awful. When Rich left, I bet there were a lot of good coaches that would’ve gone to WVU

  2. Ooooh, Dawgs over Tigers at Death Valley?

    At night?

    Georgia finally plays that good game, huh? I think you may be right.

  3. The good news in that ESPN article is that Wren doesn’t seem interested in trading away Yunel or KJ. That can only be good news.

    It would seem to me that we don’t need both Schafer and Gorkys. I don’t know that we could get away with a Schafer-Gorkys/Medlen/Lillibridge trade, but I’d definitely be behind that.

  4. I think Wren ought to be saying that to the press regardless. I kind of expect that the point of this is to try to talk the Padres down to no Hanson/no Escobar, and a deal headlined by either KJ or Schafer.

    It does seem like Wren really means that we won’t trade one of the big guys, though (Heyward/Hanson/Escobar).

    Flowers seems to be a pretty sizeable trade chip at this point, though. And I think we might be just about done with Jo-Jo, though that’s pure speculation on my part. That’s the beginning of a deal.

    The big problem is that the more I think about it, the less I want to trade Schafer. We need a CF, and he’s our kind of CF. I think at this point for me to truly approve of a trade we’d have to just take Towers to the cleaners.

  5. Weldon:

    Gorkys-Medlen-Lillibridge-Flowers and one or two associated A-ballers would count as taking Towers to the cleaners. If we can do it, do it now.

  6. yes, they do. They were given 3 gifts on their 1st drive (fumble for extra 8 yards, incom. pass ruled complete, and int grounding not called) and got 3 points out of it, Pat White’s next pick basically gave them another 7. So basically their offense scored 7 total against a team that gave up 21 to Villanova.

    Auburn’s D allowed more points than any other team besides Villanova. Tubby will be on the hot seat before season’s end.

    Noel Devine is ridiculous

  7. UGH! Auburn does suck. And that’s coming from an Auburn grad(and fan). Put me on the Bama bandwagon. I hope Auburn doesn’t win another game this season(and we might not). Then maybe we’ll get rid of Tubby. Almost all of the other Auburn grads I’m talking to are saying the same thing. Get rid of Tubby. We want Muschamp back! As head coach.

  8. Auburn is basically Michigan with a few more upperclassmen. Biggest difference, Tubby has been at AU for 10 years. Yikes!

  9. Tubby didnt have to recruit for the past 5 years, no one in state wanted to come to Bama. Now Saban is dominating the in state recruiting and Tubby is having to work. Times are bleak at Aub. Not much talent there (except on the def. side)

  10. This guy from Atlanta called in to the Herd yesterday bragging about the SEC over the PAC-10. And this year, he doesn’t have an argument. And Colin just nailed him on it. I tend to disagree with Colin Cowherd a lot, but he just nailed this guy on the SEC-supremacy deal. Outside of Alabama, Florida, Georgia, and LSU, who else is there this year? And outside of Stafford and Tebow, what are quarterbacks are truly legit?

  11. Well, South Carolina is pretty tough this year.. capibale of beating anyone, but not an elite team. So is Vandy. Ole Miss dosen’t suck too bad. I of course, Auburn, Tenessee, Mississippi State, and Arkansas all suck pretty hard. I think the Big 12 is just as tough as the SEC this year, but the Pac-10? no buy.

    If no team finishes undefeated this year and a 1-loss SEC or Big 12 team gets snubbed for USC, OSU, or Penn St, I am going to be completely done with the BCS.

  12. On an unrealted note… I am cool with making Hanson and Esco untouchable. But not being willing to include Schafer in a package to get a guy like Peavy (as reported in the article) is just stupid.

    Getting a Cy Young Award winning pitcher who’s contract is locked up for the next 4 years in the prime of his career is well worth losing the everyday centerfielder of the future we are all expecting Shafer to be.

  13. CourtneyC, it’s all part of negotiation. Eventually, I believe the deal will include one of Wren’s so-called untouchables.

  14. Auburn truly sucks…I have too many relatives who went to WVU…I just hope that Vandy beats Puke….

  15. Have I missed the comments on Hampton here? or did nobody mention that the same article that said he didn’t want to give up the top prospects also said he hopes to re-sign Hampton. Usually that sort of thing would garner at least SOME Bravesjournal response :D

  16. Does anyone know Peavey’s home/road splits? Turner Field is a pretty good pitcher’s park but nothing like Patco. FWIW, Peter Gammons thinks Peavey will end up in Atlanta–which probably means he will end up in St. Louis.

    And, Mac, I think you need to express your feelings about Tennessee more honestly. :)

  17. Well, someone has to pitch. As long as they don’t assume Hampton will be healthy and good—and thus pay him accordingly—I have no problem with it.

  18. “i” is more than 79. I don’t know how, it just will be.

    Why Tennessee is better than every other state.

    – Tennessee is the Volunteer state because Tennesseans are 1,000 times braver than people from other states. During the War of 1812, a Tennessean named Andrew Jackson volunteered himself and his troops to defend the city of New Orleans from British troops; in a battle that didnt even matter! The war had been over for several days! Just imagine if Hurricane Katrina had tried to take on Jackson?

    – Thousands of Tennesseans fought in the Revolutionary War and Tennessee wasnt even a state or a colony!

    -We founded and stole Texas from Mexico!

    -During the Mexican-American war, President James K. Polk (a Tennessean) needed 3,000 men to volunteer to fight. 30,000 Tennesseans stepped up to fight and crushed Mexico. In fact, Mexico was beaten so badly they gave the United States: California, Nevada, Utah and parts of Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, and Wyoming. Just imagine if Tennessee was responsible for boarder control? The United States would be annexing Cancun and Mexico City in the next three weeks!

    -We invented Rock and Roll.

    – During World War I, Alvin York killed 32 Germans and captured 132 others, ALL BY HIMSELF!

    -More Famous Tennesseans:

    Eddy Arnold singer, Henderson
    Chet Atkins guitarist, Lutrell
    Hattie Caraway first elected woman senator, Bakerville
    Davy Crockett frontiersman, Green City
    Jack Curtis screenwriter, Stony Creek
    David G. Farragut first American admiral, Knoxville
    Lester Flatt bluegrass musician, Overton Cty
    Tennessee Ernie Ford singer, Bristol
    Morgan Freeman actor, Memphis
    Abe Fortas jurist, Memphis
    Aretha Franklin singer, Memphis
    Nikki Giovanni poet, Knoxville
    Albert Gore Jr. U.S. vice president, Washington, D.C.
    Isaac Hayes composer, Covington
    Benjamin L. Hooks civil rights activist, Memphis
    Cordell Hull secretary of state, Overton Cty
    Dolly Parton singer, Sevierville
    Minnie Pearl singer, comedienne, Centerville
    Elvis Aaron Presley singer/King of Rock and Roll (born in Mississippi, but they are too scared to claim him, knowing that Tennessee could invade at any moment), Memphis
    Grantland Rice sportswriter, Murfreesboro
    Carl Rowan journalist, Ravenscraft
    Wilma Rudolph runner, St. Bethlehem
    Sequoia Cherokee scholar, educator
    Cybil Shepherd actress, Memphis
    Dinah Shore actress, singer, Winchester
    Billy Smith author, wiffle ball champion, Cleveland
    Pat Summitt winningest basketball coach ever, Clarksville
    Tina Turner singer, Brownsville
    Reggie White professional football player, Chattanooga
    Al Wilson professional football player/ folk hero, Jackson
    Alvin York World War I hero, Pall Mall

    (I am sure there a many more, but this is getting long)

    -Tennessee became the thirty-sixth and clinching state to ratify the 19th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, which allowed women the right to vote.

    -During Japans attack on Pearl Harbor, the USS Tennessee was sunk. The US government realized that a massive weapon was needed to even the score. The Germans, still feeling the affects of one Tennessean, knew better than to send spies to Tennessee. The government was aware of this, and began production of the atomic bomb in Oak Ridge. When word spread about what was going on, Germany quickly surrendered. Japan, not taking the hint, found out twice, what happens when you mess with Tennessee.

    -We have a football stadium that is so large; on game days it becomes the fifth largest city in the state!

  19. JC, I don’t actually have a problem with them pursuing Hampton if he’s getting paid a reasonable amount either. I hate that he got hurt all the time, but I don’t think he was TRYING to screw the team out of money, and if that risk is taken into account if we offer him a contract I think we should certainly look at him as an option.

    Marc, I looked up his splits the other day and in most years he’s had fairly even splits, but last year he was era of 4+ on the road and 1.75ish at home. Not sure what that indicates.

  20. Smitty,

    As a fellow Tennessean by birth, I heartily endorse your description of Tennessee, especially the part about the Germans being afraid to send spies. You could also have mentioned Andrew Johnson, president, but perhaps he would not be a real illustrious example of Tennesseans considering he was nearly thrown out of office. But you could also mention that Chattanooga was the site of the Battle above the Clouds, one of the turning points in the Civil War.

  21. Jackson wasn’t really a Tennessean, either. Like James K. Polk, he was a Carolinian by birth.

    David Price should absolutely be on the list of great Tennesseans.

  22. This blog is like a box of chocolates. Who suspected that we’d be treated to Tennessee Boosterism 101 this morning?

    I think that not mentioning anything about Lynchburg automatically gives the treatise a “C”.

    Isn’t Reece Witherspoon from Tennessee, as well?

  23. Yeah, Auburn should fire one of the most successful coaches in its history… that makes a lot of sense. If they fire Tubberville, they are going to sorely regret it. He is going to have to step up recruiting, because I’d say we don’t have talent on either side of the ball. Muschamp had them playing above their heads last year.

    AU fans got spoiled with the 04 year, and for some reason expect us to be in SEC championship consideration every year. Auburn used to suck even worse than they do now, I’ll take Tommy’s average 10 wins per year to Bama’s recent woes anyday, thank you. As you all know, all teams have down years, and it’s not the end of the world.

  24. During Jackson’s life, few residents were really from Tennessee. They all moved there, which makes Jackson a classic Tennesseean of his time. At least, that’s how I view it.

    At the NC capital in Raleigh there is a statue of NC’s 3 native presidents: Jackson, Johnson, and Polk. The funny thing is Jackson was from SC (though my NC history books in school said otherwise) and all three would claim TN as their home.

  25. I did not know Johnson was from NC.

    Yeah, I know why Jackson is considered a Tennessean, I just don’t buy it!

    Polk is the only candidate Tennessee’s ever had who carried the state in the presidential election.

  26. Yep, leave it to NC to produce the first impeached President.

    And though Polk would consider himself to be a Tennessean, Polk is from an old NC family, so it is fair for NC to claim him. I believe his family home stood at the corner of Trad and Tryon in Charlotte. For those of you not familiar with Charlotte, that is the dead-center of downtown. …the things you pick up when your father is a local historian.

  27. “I’ll take Tommy’s average 10 wins per year to Bama’s recent woes anyday”

    recent woes = 7-0 and #2 in the Nation with a very young team. Looks like things may be changing, and after the Franklin firing there is no coordinator wanting that job. Like it or not, Saban is a great coach

  28. Recent as in for the past 7 years Bama was floating at .500. I am not denying Saban’s coaching ability, and I’m not hating on them for their success.

  29. Morgan Freeman may have been born in a Memphis hospital but he’s from Charleston Mississippi in Tallahatchie County and still lives there to this day.

  30. I forgot about Jack Daniels in Lynchburg and also barbecue in Memphis, especially the Rendezvous. Not historically significant but still something good about Tennessee. Also, Tennessee isn’t Arkansas.

  31. Since this is, after all, a baseball blog…

    Alabama: Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Willie McCovey, Satchel Paige, Ozzie Smith, Joe Sewell, Don Sutton, Jake Peavy.

    Tennessee: Tim McCarver.

  32. I hope to God you’re right about Wren just BSing, because if he’s not, he’s a complete retard, and we’re doomed to failure for the foreseeable future. You have Jake Peavy, a Cy Young Award candidate right now vs. Tommy Hanson, a prospect who would become as good as Peavy only if our wildest dreams come true. You have two outfield prospects…why in the hell would you not be willing to trade one of them? I sincerely hope to God that Wren is not one of those prospect hoarding GMs, because if he is, we’re completely doomed. The likelihood is that only one of Hanson, Schaeffer and Hernandez will be worth a crap in the majors. And since we’d already be getting Peavy, if the one is Hanson, who really cares?

    I really, really hate the prospect hoarding mentality this team has had for the last several years. And out of all of those prospects how many have turned into excellent Major League players? One, with the possibility for two with Esocbar, maybe. More likely Escobar will be in with Kelly Johnson as an OK Major Leaguer. The rest have all sucked. Every single one of them (and no, I’m not going to give our system credit for Jurrjens, before you ask). Now tell me again exactly what it is that’s supoosed to make me believe that every single one of these guys, or even more than one or two, is going to be at least a decent Major League player. And to make it worth hoarding them and not trading for Peavy, they would have to be better than decent. They would have to be truly excellent for an extended number of years. It’s just not going to happen. Find the one or two you like the best, hold onto them, and then for God’s sake, trade the rest of them before they become a bunch of Jeff Francoeurs and Bruce Chens.

  33. You forgot Jeff Bennett and Greg McMichael, Stu. And let us not forget about Bubba Trammell, heh. In all seriousness though, this is as stoked as I’ve been for a football game this year, by far. If we could somehow find a way to win this game and ruin Alabama’s season, it might actually offset losses to all the remaining teams on our schedule who aren’t from Wyoming.

  34. I find this very educational.
    Tennessee women must have a particular quality about them. When I Googled “Famous Tennessee Women” for pictures, all of the ladies on the first page were very tall. Orange jerseys seem to be popular there, too!

  35. You are right about the All-State baseball teams, though. I think David Price might actually be Tennessee’s Game 1 starter, unless there’s someone obvious I’m missing. And while I’m sure that would excite Stu, it’s a little ridiculous considering he’s been in the majors for like two months.

    I guess a conversation could be had about Honeycutt, but wasn’t he a reliever for most of his career?

  36. I don’t think we’d have much All Mississippi Baseball team but we’d have a pretty good football squad.

    Brett Favre, Charlie Connerly, Steve McNair or Archie/Eli Manning throwing to Jerry Rice and Lance Alworth and Wesley Walls at Tightend and handing the ball off to Walter Payton. Not a bad backfield.

  37. @49 yeah, I’d hate to be a prospect hoardingteam like, let’s say the Tampa Bay Rays.

    The last time we traded prospects like you suggest we do we ended up with roughly 1 season of Tex which didn’t really help us at all. Emptying the farm system makes sense if we’re one piece away, but we’re obviously not that close to competing

  38. You got me on McCarver Mac. We should ban him.

    I know there are tons of other great Tennessean things (like Jack Daniels, Rendezvous and the Grand Old Opry) there were just too many to name.


    David Price will be on the list soon though.

    Most early Tennesseans are from North or South Carolina. Jackson is very much up in ther air between the two. When it was all said and done though, he was a Tennessean.

    You folks in Georgia that want to annex part of Tennessee for our water; just remember what happened when the Mexican government pissed us off in Texas. You’ll be paying Tennessee state sales tax in Macon.

  39. “You folks in Georgia that want to annex part of Tennessee for our water; just remember what happened when the Mexican government pissed us off in Texas. You’ll be paying Tennessee state sales tax in Macon.”

    Harrumph. Also riding to the Texans’ rescue was a cavalry company that mustered in Crawford County, Georgia (county seat – Knoxville), and arrived in time to help defeat Mexico at San Jacinto. Officials of the new Republic of Texas were overwhelmed at the hardiness and valor of the Georgian riders, and wished to pay appropriate tribute. It was noted that the Georgians had arrived bearing a striking flag sewn by a Crawford County seamstress — a single gold star on a blue background….

  40. That said, you’re completely right about the Tennessee River, smitty. State legislatures can be downright embarrassing….

    From what I’ve read, there does seem to be credible evidence that the border was drawn from a botched survey, but that’s rendered moot by “adverse possession” — you’ve tended to it, so it’s yours.

  41. The various legal theories for why Georgia can’t get the land, despite the fact that it was originally supposed to, include adverse possession and acquiescence, but the real reason is far simpler—reliance. For over 100 years, the people living in that part of the country have believed themselves to be Tennessee residents, and you can’t just call them Georgians and force them to pay state income tax after all that time.

  42. That makes sense.

    Speaking of taxes and borders, the people of Vancouver, Washington have it made. No state income tax in Washington, and they’re 10 minutes from Portland, Oregon, where there’s no state sales tax….

  43. Mac,
    From Tennessee to Georgia??? As someone with a fair amount of livin’ in both places: Please.

    Sounds like a better version of Chattanooga.

  44. Hmm, I may have to move to Vancouver, WA. Of course then I’d be stuck with Pac-10 football…

  45. And you can’t get drunk if you drink out of a brown paper bag.

    At least according to my high school buddy’s alcoholic father.

  46. Well, in my experience, brown paper bags don’t hold liquids very well, and any attempt to drink from one usually results in a disaster with spilled drink all over the floor, and a soggy, not reusable rag of a paper bag in my hand.

    So yes, it is impossible to get drunk drinking out of a brown paper bag. Maybe if you eat the bag, kind of like a special brownie?

  47. It is my opinion that the few times hoarding prospects works, such as with this years Rays, are the exceptions which prove the rule and make every cheapskate GM and owner in baseball think they can do it, too. At least 85% of the time though, it doesn’t work.

    The only reason it has worked with the Rays is that they have drafted exceptionally well. Like, I wouldn’t be shocked if their last five years of drafts was one of the best five-year drafting periods in the history of the draft, if not the best.

    We, on the other hand, haven’t been drafting worth a shit. We’ve been drafting more based on geography than on talent. So, it’s not gonna work for us. Plus, that plan would take at least three years to start bearing any fruit at all, and that works for an expansion team with no history of success, but is unacceptable for us, in my opinion, especially since we have a $100 million payroll, which the Rays do not.

  48. Still in Amsterdam…

    I had to explain what the World Series was to somebody today. And I had to answer the obvious question: “Why do you call it the World Series?”

    Highlight of the convention so far: I met the guy from Milli Vanilli. He didn’t mind re-telling me the whole scandal/saga & was very nice about it. Still, a pretty bizarre conversation.

    BTW, I picked up a really entertaining baseball book before I left. It’s called “Crazy 08” by Cait Murphy and it’s all about the 1908 baseball season. Really good, very vivid description of the time and the players, etc. I’m only about 100 pages in, but it’s terrific so far.

    Is the Chamber of Commerce giving you kickbacks so you don’t have to discuss the Vols?

    My question: Will the Fatman survive another season? Or does he pull another job-saving upset tomorrow?

    The Georgia/Tennessee convo is amusing. Georgia’s got Little Richard & Otis Redding, not to mention James Brown. Rock, soul & funk.

    I’ll take that over Rock City & Tennessee Ernie Ford, but that’s just me.

  49. I actually intended to have a Georgia vs. Tennessee music showdown game thread week late in the season but was too depressed. I’ll take the names mentioned above plus the Athenians over Nashville, thank you.

  50. @74,

    Luck in drafting plays a role as well as being so bad for so many years that you get lots of very high draft picks. But there is no reason you can’t do both–develop your own players and make judicious trades and free agent signings. That’s what the Red Sox do although obviously they have more money to spend. Certainly, one benefit of having a deep farm system is the ability to make trades. The point is, though, that you don’t give away all your prospects for short-term fixes. Not to say that Peavey is a short-term fix but just because not all the prospects have worked out doesn’t mean you should go out and trade them all away. In fact, a lot of Braves draftees (albeit no pitchers) have worked out–McCann, Escobar, KJ–that’s not bad. It’s not that you should hoard prospects, it’s that you shouldn’t trade all of your best ones away for a single guy. I don’t know where the balance is but any GM should be operating on a cost-benefit basis.

  51. Mike Gonzalez

    Last year, after missing half the season for Tommy John, he pitched 33 and 2/3’s inning in 36 games. He had 44 K’s and an ERA of 4.28. He had 14 saves and will be a free agent after next season. He is also 30 years old.

    I say his value is moderate right now; however, if he has a year next year like he had in ’06 with the Pirates, (for when we gave up LaRoche…how different would things be if that deal never went down) at the very least he is Brian Fuentes territory in terms of contract; Fuentes is also 32.

    Mike Gonzalez ’06: 54 IP, 13 R, 64 SO, 2.14 ERA
    Brian Fuentes ’08: 63 IP, 20 R, 82 SO, 2.73 ERA

    Do you roll the dice and try to sign Gonzalez long term now?

    He made 2.36 MM last year and will probably go up to around 4 MM this year. If you could go with a two year extension for 15 MM and bump him to 6 MM this year, I say do it.

    Maybe something like: 2009 6MM, 2010 7MM, and 2011 8MM.

    He’s wild, but you figure he’ll only get better as he recovers more from TJ. Plus, he’s definitely a closer. Even when Soriano was having a good year in ’07, you weren’t always sure he was up to closing the door. Gonzalez, for whatever baggage he might have, IMO, owns the job.

    Other possibilities might be: the aforementioned Soriano or Atrosta and further down the line Marek and Kimbrel (whom I’m worried might turn into Joey Devine 2.0)

    Does that seem too high/low? Thoughts?

  52. I’m also forgetting Ray Charles (Albany) & Ma Rainey (Columbus), the first great female blues singer, precursor to Bessie Smith.

    Tennessee does pretty well with music—OK, I like Dolly and a few others—but don’t go claiming Elvis (Mississippi) and Johnny Cash (Arkansas). If Tennessee claims those guys, then Georgia can claim the Allman Brothers.

  53. Dave O’Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution talked to Braves GM Frank Wren today. Wren says there are players he will not trade under any circumstances, and O’Brien believes three of those are Tommy Hanson, Jason Heyward, and Julio Teheran. Freddie Freeman, Jordan Schafer, and Gorkys Hernandez are close to untouchable, according to O’Brien

  54. Depends on your definition of Nashville, Mac. Does Johnny Cash, a native of Arkansas, count? I will say that it’s tough for anyone, anywhere to beat Otis Redding.

    I love how ububba defines the parameters of the debate. That’s akin to saying, “I’ll take Johnny Cash and the Smokey Mountains over Macon, but that’s just me.”

  55. ububba,
    How many of those Athens bands were Georgia natives? Stipe’s the only Georgian in R.E.M., right?

    Of course Georgia would win any “famous people” race with Tennessee—check out the population differential between the two. Doesn’t really address the question of where you’d rather live, though.

  56. David the Builder
    Peter the Iberian
    Malkhaz Abdushelishvili
    Arnold Chikobava
    Ekvtime Takaishvili
    Nino Ananiashvili
    George Balanchine
    Giorgi Khvitia
    Vakhtang Chabukiani
    Zurab Kikaleishvili
    Irma Nioradze
    Vera Tsignadze
    Maka Makharadze
    Nikolai Tsiskaridze
    Dimitri Arakishvili
    Vazha Azarashvili
    Shalva Azmaiparashvili
    Andria Balanchivadze
    Meliton Balanchivadze
    Alexandre Basilaia
    Alexander Borodin
    Nodar Gabunia
    Otar Gordeli
    Gia Kancheli
    Bidzina Kvernadze
    Zurab Nadarejshvili
    Zakharia Paliashvili
    Nicko Sulkhanishvili
    Otar Taktakishvili
    Sulkhan Tsintsadze
    Paata Burchuladze
    Gogi Chagelishvili
    Elene Akhvlediani
    Alexander Toradze
    Katie Melua
    Valery Meladze
    Alexander Sumbatashvili-Yuzhin
    Roman Dzindzichashvili
    Zaza Pachulia
    Natalia Nasaridze

    Debate over

  57. If I was Wren, I’d sign Mike Gonzalez to a two-year deal this offseason like Rafael Soriano got last year.

    I think Gonzalez is going to be good in 2009.

  58. I’ll second the rec of “Crazy ’08” — one of my favorite books this year. It helps to have a baseball encyclopedia handy to look up some of the names, although I doubt that ububba hauled an old copy of Total Baseball across the pond…

  59. sansho1,
    You may not believe this, but I have many of those players in APBA. So I’m strangely familiar with many of them.

    One of my all-time favorite APBA teams is the 1906 Cubs—impossible to find better pitching. And Honus Wagner, Ty Cobb, John McGraw, Christy Mathewson, & Hal Chase are all really interesting in their own ways.

    But what I love about that book is how the author puts everything in cultural context. Her descriptions of Chicago from that era are really vivid.

    Mills (born in California) & Berry (born in Minnesota, same town as one Robert Zimmerman) went to high school in Macon, Buck (born in Cali) in Atlanta. Stipe, the only one born in Georgia, went to high school in the St. Louis area. (His dad was an Army helicopter pilot & they moved around.) Three of them attended UGA, Buck attended Emory. The one commonality is the state of Georgia.

    Tennessee has Nashville & Memphis. Alabama has Muscle Shoals. Georgia essentially has Atlanta, Athens & Macon.

    But, c’mon, Rock City is pretty cheesy.

  60. The Chicago stuff really does elevate it beyond a “mere” baseball book. I read “The Devil in the White City” not long before — a great read that chronicles the creation of the 1893 Chicago World’s Fair, with a mass murderer thrown in to keep the pages turning. Between those two books, I think I’ve got turn-of-the-20th-century Chicago pretty much licked.

  61. ububba,
    I can’t argue with that. I was just saying it’s unfair to compare the best things to come out of one state with the stupidest tourist traps of another.

  62. Tommy Hanson has 6 strikeouts and 2 walks after 2 innings of the AFL Rising Stars game.

    Not bad.

  63. Just got around to taking a peek at the Sickels list. Very heavy on young players; not many at AA or AAA–possible none of the top 20 will be in ATL at the beginning of the season. Just reinforces the sense that this is a team for 2010 not 2009. Of course, part of the reason the AA and AAA prospects are thin is that team (rightly or wrongly) did not horde prospects like Salty, Andrus, Harrison, and Devine.

  64. Stu,
    I know dat. I’m just funnin’ ya. Always hit the softest spot & you’ll get a reaction. (Georgia, after all, has Stone Mountain, which has deeper implications.)

    APBA is a simulated baseball game, invented in the early 1950s & only marginally popular today. (Video games with crazy graphics have essentially replaced it.) Originally, APBA was just with cards, but in the last 20 years or so, it’s been available for PC (APBA for Windows).

    Its main competitor is/was a game called Strat-O-Matic. (Famous APBA players: David Eisenhower & George W. Bush. Hmm…)

    APBA comes out each year with new editions based on the previous season. Also, you can buy any season in the past (or a collection of great, pennant-winning clubs). They even offer the Negro Leagues.

    Each player has an individual card tweaked to perform in the game just as the real player did during the season. For example, John Smoltz in his Cy Young Award season would be a “Grade A” pitcher, while Shane Reynolds as a Brave would be a “Grade D” pitcher.

    From playing the older teams and older seasons, APBA gave me an understanding of those players & a historical perspective of what games from each era were like.

    I haven’t done it in a while—I guess I have less time on my hands—but I used to draw up crazy tournaments of, say, “every team that ever won a pennant.” It would take a few weeks, but I’d end up playing them all & getting a result.

    From that, certain teams’ personalities would come through & I’d take a shine to certain clubs that were around before I discovered the game. The ’06 Cubs (with Mordecai “Three-Finger” Brown) were one of them. Always loved the ’57 Braves (Hurricane Hazle!), but my all-time fave was the ’53 Brooklyn Dodgers.

  65. I play in two computer-based APBA leagues. Cary, who drops in sometimes, is in them too — Alex R. used to be but he dropped out, something about a kid or something.

  66. ububba;
    Re:75 and 92
    I’m no longer living my life vicarously through your exploits. You set a whole new standard for world weariness when you go to Amsterdam and bring along a BOOK!

    Smile(I can’t do emoticons)

  67. Yeah but despite the hype, I still say:

    Peavy > Hanson

    Thomas Hanson can only wish right now that he will be as good as Peavy has proven to be in the majors.

  68. That being said, I would still trade Hanson straight up for Peavy. We would be robbing the Pads. But if they tell me it is necessary to throw in Schafer and Escobar, well, no thank you.

  69. Parish @ 111,

    You have probably hit it. That is, if Hanson is the only relatively sure fire prospect and if no other ML talent that we need is traded, then maybe the Peavy deal makes sense. Otherwise, no.

    However, I would still hold off on that until after FA kicks off and make sure what else I can get, because if the other elements aren’t there, might as well let the kids sort themsleves out next year.

  70. Music:

    When Georgia can start up something like Sun Records (where Rock & Roll was started) let me know. I have heard of the “Memphis Sound,” but never of the “Gerogia Sound.”

    Georgia: Just trying to steal good things from Tennessee cir. 1796.

  71. ububba,

    The only shot Fulmer has to stay is to win out. If he beats Bama today, and they win out, he may stay.

    I personally think the Auburn game may have been the final nail.

  72. Georgia’s D-Line continues to underwhelm, and their penchant for missed tackles and penalties continues to make me angry.

  73. Kevin,
    I haven’t picked up the book since I got off the airplane. But, y’know, it’s a long flight.

    You have heard of Athens, right? You have heard of Macon’s Capricorn Records, right?

    You’ve heard of James Brown, who’s from the Georgia city of Augusta? He invented this form of music called funk, which ultimately informed the most popular music in America called hip hop.

  74. #108 sounds like more misunderstanding of Smoltz’s comments to me.

    If he’s able, he’ll be pitching for the Braves.

    There’s no way there isn’t room in our rotation or pen for him.

  75. I’d like to apologize for arguing that we’re better than South Carolina and Ole Miss. I was mistaken.

  76. lol. It’s alright man, it’s understandable considering that y’all haven’t been to a bowl in forever. I hope Vandy can pick up another win this year to make a bowl.

  77. Braves14,
    There’s a huge difference between the New York Daily News and the New York Times, which is the very best newspaper in this country.

    BTW, how ’bout them Dawgs?

  78. Richt’s Dawgs are 28-4 on the road.

    They’re 22-4 on the road vs SEC teams.

    They’re 10-2 on the road vs. ranked teams on the road.

    Next week’s Jacksonville tussle should be fun.

  79. Funk isn’t the only thing James Brown invented. Perhaps you have heard of a guitarist of his named Jimi Hendrix. The horn section of the Famous Flames, the JB’s, later known as the Horny Horns in Parliament-Funkadelic — that is, Fred Wesley and Maceo Parker — are profound influences on fusion-era jazz. If you have heard any electronic music ever, you have heard the break from “Funky Drummer.”

    He’s more or less the most important person or one of the most important people ever in at least four genres: soul/R&B, funk, hip-hop, and thanks to the aforementioned drum sample and others like it, electronica. R&B-inflected rock and roll (think The Who, who covered two James Brown songs on their first album, or Them, or most other British bands of the era: the Beatles, the Rolling Stones, Cream, early Pink Floyd, etc., along with American bands with similar tastes, like the MC5, which makes him a godfather of punk too) and jazz fusion pretty much wouldn’t exist without him either. In short, virtually every genre of popular music invented in the 20th century is either his direct progeny or has come under his influence.

    He’s on a short list, along with possibly only Louis Armstrong, for the title of single most important and influential popular musician of the 20th century. He gets my vote.

  80. as lengthy as JB’s accomplishments are, i really dont get the Cream connection. and the two Who covers(strictly filler) are among the worst covers of anything ever recorded.even Jagger doing his lamest blackface bits cant compare to a 20 yr. old Daltry doing the Godfather. and that was the only bit of “soul” music they ever tried………… much for influence……… as far as influnces go, i’d have to rank JB far behind a certain mr. Zimmerman…….i know Jimi was in his band briefly but as far as i can tell, he never recorded anything with them. hiring great muscians,(and fining them if they miss a beat onstage)doesnt make you influencial, it makes you rich.

  81. It’s very hard to hear too much Brown influence in the Stones, much less the Beatles. The Godfather of Soul is the Grandfather of Hip-Hop, but let’s not exaggerate. I’d probably put Chuck Berry ahead of him for overall influence, plus Lennon and McCartney.

  82. Re: 113 above (admittedly a random comment). You mean, like the Tennessee River? Last summer’s attempted water grab was pretty amazing. I guess they’ll try to take Chattanooga next. Before its downtown was redone, Tennessee would probably have let them.

  83. At this point in time in the U.S.—it’s a hip-hop world—James Brown (“Funky Drummer” & his breakbeats in general) is more influential than The Beatles and Bob Dylan.

    And the dance-music-loving Europeans hold James Brown in a much higher regard than we do. But then again, they did the same thing for Robert Johnson, Muddy Waters & The Ramones.

  84. I’m looking forward to the report, three years from now, of an 800-pound Philip Fulmer who has to be lifted from house, bed and all, with a crane and taken to the hospital. I really, really hate Philip Fulmer, and I am enjoying this so very much. Schadenfreudest weekend ever.

  85. Vandy couldn’t beat Puke…I suppose the lesson here is that Vandy’s bowl chances are so small that Puke gets to be the team that administers the fate of Sisyphus to the Commodores….

    Now even beating Fulmer’s hapless squad won’t be enough….

  86. The interesting thing about James Brown is that he wasn’t particularly original — what he did wasn’t that different from what other people were doing on the chitlin circuit, and his takes on soul and rhythm and blues weren’t that jaw-droppingly unique for the time among black audiences in the south. But his songs were good, and he brought them to a wider audience, he had a better band, and ultimately it was his vision — and his dance moves, which Michael Jackson copied to make the moonwalk — that made the world a better place forever.

    No, the Stones and the Beatles didn’t cover him. But I don’t see how you can listen to Lennon and Jagger scream and shriek without hearing James Brown’s original “eeeeeeh!” And whether or not you like Daltrey’s take on “Please Please Please,” when The Who advertised themselves as “Maximum R&B,” that’s pretty much exactly who and what they were trying to go for.

  87. Also, I admit that this is totally personal prejudice, but I tend to underrate Chuck Berry’s contributions to rock. Muddy Waters went electric years before Chuck hit the scene; Ike Turner cut “Rocket 88” in 1951. Elvis’s “That’s All Right Mama” dropped in 1954 — the same year Johnny Cash started playing with the Tennessee Three — a full year before Chuck broke out with “Maybelline.” (Thanks, Wikipedia!) Berry’s a terrific songwriter, great showman, and undoubtedly one of the great early rockers, but he wasn’t the first. Just one of the earliest, and one of the best.

    Dylan, of course, is in a class of his own, but I’d argue that, as far as influence goes, he influenced a lot more people lyrically than he influenced musically.

  88. Wow, a lengthy James Brown discussion is one of the more obscure, and interesting, topics ever on this board.

  89. good to see Alex has been doing his homework. its great fun to go back and try to sort out the influnces. i always thought Lennon wanted to be Elvis and McCartney wanted to be Little Richard( or maybe Andy Williams). Jagger wanted to be Marvin Gaye and Keith wanted to be Chuck Berry.( and i believe the Stones are the only band to ever improve a Chuck Berry song) i sure cant argue with Ububba about the hip-hop stuff since all i know about it is which way to run when i hear it.

  90. you always were vanderbilt, it’s just that you are occasionally good at football.

    you are occasionally pretty awful at football, too.

    sometimes you’re both in the same season.

    other times you’re both in the same game.

    even OTHER times, you’re both in the same series.

  91. I just don’t hear it. I see it with Jagger, who pretty obviously did a lot of Brown-style stuff on stage, and still does. But musically… No, I just don’t. The Stones were doing more traditional blues stuff mixed with the Beatles.

    As for the Beatles… I’ve read a pretty significant portion of every interview Lennon ever did, and I don’t recall him even mentioning James Brown. Elvis, Berry, Holly, Motown. And McCartney, as mentioned above, wanted to be Little Richard when he didn’t want to be Cole Porter.

  92. SEC Power Rankings:

    1. Alabama
    2. Georgia
    3. Florida
    4. LSU
    5. Ole Miss
    6. USC
    7. Vandy
    8. Arkansas
    9. Kentucky
    10. Tulane
    11. Sewanee
    12. MSU
    13. Auburn
    14. Tennessee

  93. What about Ray Charles? And for the record, Hendrix never played for JB, he played for Little RIchard. Mac, the thought of Chuck Berry being more influential or important than JB is laughable. Stick to your Journey and Steely Dan, when it comes to pre 1969 music you’re clueless.

  94. Journey? Take that back.

    I’m not saying that James Brown wasn’t influential, I’m saying that his impact is somewhat overstated, particularly on rock & roll. Hip-hop and Funk, sure, and later-period Motown — but not on the “line” of popular music that goes from the Beatles and the other British Invasion bands. If anything, they have a common ancestor in Little Richard. I seriously doubt that the Beatles were more than vaguely familiar with Brown in 1962 — he had never hit the American pop chart at that point. Like I said above, I’m pretty well-read in the Beatles’ literature, and I don’t think I’ve ever seen one of them mention Brown as an influence. And the Stones just don’t sound like Brown, as much as Jagger sometimes acts like him.

  95. Come on Mac…

    the Vols beat MSU.

    I think Fulmer is done. It is kind of sad. He is Tennessee football, but I just don’t see how we bring him back

  96. In this case it does because USC isn’t coming off a loss to MSU like Vandy was. Our last game was a 24-17 loss against LSU.

  97. Braves14’s SEC Bowl projections…

    MNC: Alabama
    Sugar: Florida
    Capital One: Georgia
    Cotton: LSU
    Outback: USC
    Peach: Ole Miss
    Music City: Vandy (or Tennessee, whichever makes it to 6 wins)
    Liberty: Kentucky

    I don’t think any other teams will be bowl eligible.

  98. Wow. The SEC really drops off after those first four (three?) teams. Florida/Georgia’s going to be a fantastic matchup, with the winner playing for the SEC championship and, likely, a chance to go to the national championship.

  99. Put another way, USCe was coming off a 7-point home loss, whereas Vanderbilt was coming off a 3-point road loss.

    We’ll win 6 games, maybe 7. Oh, what could have been, though…

  100. Put another way, Vandy lost to the cow chip of the SEC, while USC lost to the defending national champion.

  101. Put yet another way, we still have a better record, a better conference record (including a 1+ game lead in the standings), and a 2-game winning streak over USCe. As a fan of a team that just lost to the Vanderbilt of the ACC, I can imagine how frustrating it must be demonstrate such ineptitude with respect to the real thing.

  102. NY Post:

    The pitcher who started against Hughes in the Rising Stars game was Atlanta’s Tommy Hanson, who is a key figure in ongoing trade discussions about San Diego ace Jake Peavy. Braves GM Frank Wren has vowed that he will not trade the organization’s top prospects, and Hanson is certainly in that class.

    Three Padres officials, including director of pro and international scouting Randy Smith, watched Hanson dominate the Rising Stars game: Three no-hit innings with seven strikeouts.

    A scout in attendance claimed Hughes is not in the same league as Hanson, saying about the 22-year-old righty: “He is at least a number two starter. He has plus stuff and plus command. He throws his fastball 90-94 (mph), but smartly adds in two-seamers at 89-90. He has a plus slider and a plus curveball. He mixes his pitches well. He has poise. He has smarts. He puts the ball where he wants. To me the Braves have no choice, he should be in their rotation next year.

  103. Actually, please ignore all of the above, braves14. I’m just grumpy about the freaking Duke game, but that’s no excuse. As I said yesterday, you guys are obviously the better team right now, and it’s pointless for me to argue about how we should have been perceived a week ago. Sorry for being such a tool.

  104. lol, no problem. Vandy’s season so far is a replay of ours last year, so I know how it is.

  105. I have a question about Hanson and the scouting reports. Everything I read is that he’s dominant. That he’s either the best prospect left in the minors or one of the top few. And yet I also read that he’s generally considered a Number Two.

    What’s a guy gotta do to be considered a potential ace?

  106. Ithaca, my bad — I coulda sworn he’d played for JB. Oops.

    Mac, your knowledge of the Beatles is far greater than mine, and I admit I’m just making this stuff up as I go along. I think Brown does have a sizable influence on rock, but it may be greater on bands like the MC5 than on the British Invaders.

  107. Stu-

    I’ve begun to wonder about that kind of stuff, too. I guess his stuff just doesn’t blow people away. He walks a lot of guys, too, and gives up a ton of fly balls. So those are sort of concerns. I dunno. I think he’d be a great fit in SD because of the fly ball tendencies, so I can see why they’d want him.

    But maybe Wren will stick to what he’s saying (although I don’t believe I’ve ever actually heard him of him saying, “We’re not considering moving Hanson for Peavy.”) and keep Hanson around next year. I think I’d be cautiously optimistic about him. He’s by far the best pitching prospect we’ve had get this far along in a while.

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