230 thoughts on “NO LEAD IS SAFE game thread: July 28, Cardinals at Braves”

  1. Stu;
    I think you called Jake out in the last thread.
    He responded, then checked out. I hope not for good.

    I don’t get it. I thought the guy was giving us good insight, but if you see something different, please say so.

  2. 3… Stu was just wondering where it was coming from. Jake’s insight is much appreciated. But in the past it seemed like it came from a connection to a player. Not sure how a player would give insight to what the office is thinking. Stu was just trying to find out if he was just speculating or what.

  3. Is Jake the real batboy? A personal valet? An assistant traveling secretary? JS Jr in disguise?

    Speaking only for myself, I kinda need a little disclosure before I invest too much consideration.

    Mac,
    Never get tired of the Zevon.

    Y’know, in the year when everybody knew that Zevon was dying, Bob Dylan (who tours constantly) would do as many as 3 Zevon tunes a night.

    Early Y2K Dylan, doing somebody else’s material—talk about a tribute.

  4. From the previous thread, I really like the idea of getting Jason Bay from the Pirates for Batboy, B. Jones and others. If we did this, trading Tex and/or Ohman for some useful future pieces would be much easier to absorb – even this year. Heck, even if we gave Thorman a shot at 1B for the rest of the year, our offense with Bay wouldn’t be much worse than it is now (more power, less avg). We could then put our off-season focus on acquiring guys like Sheets and Dunn.

  5. I like our rotation w/o Sheets – we don’t need another Hampton.

    In fact – I’d probabaly take Sabathia before I took Sheets. Even though I think Sheets to be the better pitcher.

  6. Agree with ububba. I’ve always been suspicious. Anyone can come on and say they have a connection to the team. If he really did, I would think he would not want to risk it by blabbing to a blog.

  7. Hampton is going to sign with some team like houston or texas for 5 million with incentives and then throw 203.2 innings with a 3.67 ERA, 120 K/66 BB. I believe this maneuver is referred to as a “Paul Byrd”.

  8. According to Rosenthal Arizona has lots of pitching prospects, perhaps we could deal Tex for just pitching pieces, this would allow us to throw pitching into the mix in the Bay deal. I like the idea of having bay next year. Maybe we could move KJ or McCann to first, and sign a second baseman or catcher. The first base market is very thin this offseason, conversely second base and catcher offer plenty of depth.

  9. @6 – and I really don’t like the idea of adding Dunn. Although having him replace Frenchy wouldn’t be bad, but we have enough free-swingers on this team – and certainly enough that swing and miss.

  10. You can never have enough .400 OBP, OPS+ of 131, and 40 home runs a year. And given his OBP, I don’t know if I’d categorize Dunn as a free-swinger, though he does strike out a lot.

  11. Maybe we could move KJ or McCann to first, and sign a second baseman or catcher.

    KJ has been average a 2nd this year. That would make him WAY BELOW average for a 1st baseman’s production – not a good move. And McCann wouldn’t take the move to 1st – and I don’t know how he’d do defensively there. We just need to get a regular 1st baseman somewhere. I hear Tex will be on the market this offseason???

  12. Sorry jea, I was probably over-generalizing based on what I have seen from him. Had no idea his OBP was that high. I’d take that any day as well.

  13. How about if we trade Tex and Ohman as 2 month rentals and get someone like Jurrjens that will be ready next year. In the off-season we can re-sign them both.

    Seriously though, I like Tex, but I just don’t think he’ll be worth what he’s asking for.

  14. Just finished reading DOB’s donright depressing Blog on AJC and yeah, the market is REALLY thin for Tex. It seems we have the best shot with Arizona and he says we’re more likely to get Chad Tracy than Conor Jackson. Gee, great.

    Also, I was chatting with Cary yesterday and he mentioned that there’s more and more sentiment FINALLY against Bobby Cox’s ability to manage. This is welcome news.

    So while I believe injuries and Jeff Francouer deserve a lion’s share of the blame for our troubles (and Tex’s first month), Bobby Cox’s annual horrific use of our bullpen led to this past weekend’s debacle more than anything.

    I also agree with Cary that we should now just lose the rest of the way and go for a #1 pick. Of course, as Mac has stated, we’ll probably just select another Georgia H.S. pitcher.

  15. Flurry of moves just now. Chipper and Hudson to the DL, Reyes to Richmond; Morton, Bennett and Clint Sammons up.

  16. McCann not on the DL, though, so I would guess that they do expect that’ll it’ll only be a few days with him.

  17. @20,

    The problem, Alex, is that the person that really matters, Terry McGuirk, and I would bet Frank Wren, don’t have a problem with Bobby Cox’s managing. I think we will have Bobby for as long as he wants to manage.

  18. With the current standings postion along with the DL news on Chipper and Hudson, there is absolutely no reason to rush McCann back.

  19. My current post-hype crush Dallas McPherson hit 3 HRs yesterday to give him 38 HRs this year.

    I swear we could sign him up as a cheap 1B this offseason. He’ll be a free agent.

    Question for anyone who knows: if we traded for a minor league guy like McPherson, could we sign him to some sort of contract before the end of the season? I guess we could. I’m just not certain. I suppose he could reject the offer, but a guy who has spent all year in the PCL is unlikely to do so, I think.

    If we could, I’d send a little something down to the Marlins to make it happen.

  20. We can quibble with Bobby’s bunting, etc., but he’s not a main reason that this team is where it is. And, recent games aside, the bullpen has been pretty good.

    Just add up the games missed by guys projected to contribute this year—and now we can add Hudson (good grief). Add underperformance from a few critical spots & I’m not sure Miller Huggins or John McGraw could’ve done much with this bunch.

    It’s an exaggeration, sure, but it seems like the only person who hasn’t been hurt at some point this year is Francouer.

    (And could it be possible that Bobby outlasts Frenchy with this club?)

  21. And Morton has just been named the starter for tonight’s game, although I guess that was pretty obvious.

  22. What the frick is selling mode? If “selling mode” means “preparing for next year”, then “buying” Bay would then make us “sellers”. Gosh, I hate these terms…

    I’m hungry. I’m sorry. It makes me cranky.

  23. @20,

    Oh, we’ll never wrest the #1 pick and Stephen Strasburg from the Nats (or possibly the Mariners or Padres), but we can still end up with a tasty top 10 pick.

  24. Everyone complains about Bobby’s moves but he is no different than any other manager of his generation. Lou Piniella did the same thing yesterday against the Marlins–bunting for a run in the first inning with the Cubs struggling and the wind blowing out in Wrigley. Most managers put way too much emphasis on bunting. Bobby’s moves are generally no better or worse than other managers although it bothered me to read McGuirk saying approvingly that Bobby manages by instinct and that his instincts are nearly always right.

  25. During all-star week, I heard a radio interview with Bob Watson, who was the Yankees GM in 1996.

    He reminisced about that season and how he & Torre agreed that the best way for that team to win was play “National League ball.”

    That team had a good lineup, sure, but it was a little rotation-soft (lotsa injuries) & bullpen-strong (remember, Rivera was a setup man who threw over 100 IP that year), so they tried to “grab the lead early and keep it.”

    They’d hit & run a lot, bunt some, and Watson said they did anything they could to have a lead by the middle innings. Seemed to work out.

  26. Does this mean that he’s finally given in and agrees that we need to sell and get ready for next year?

    I’m sure he’s understood our situation for quite some time. What he tells the press is another story.

    Love Alex R’s post. Yes after all these years, Bobby’s jig is up. He’s finally been exposed. Good grief.

  27. Hudson’s on the DL now? If ever there was a doubt that the Braves should sell, I think that move clears it up. Not that there was much doubt.

  28. I’m with Robert. Bobby can’t come out and say anything other than “we’re trying to win”, or he’d be crucified.

  29. Just saw this on DOB’s blog:

    By the way, I’ve seen two different lineups for tonight, one with Norton hitting cleanup and one with Kotsay in that spot.

    Norton? Kotsay? How sad has our season gotten?

  30. And that folks is why I also advocated trading Hudson a week or so ago.

    He’s on the wrong side of 30 and will begin to decline, perhaps precipitiously.

  31. “Flurry of moves just now. Chipper and Hudson to the DL, Reyes to Richmond; Morton, Bennett and Clint Sammons up.”

    Finally, they realize this season is lost. When did Jose Reyes become Horatio Ramirez? Very unfortunate. McCann says he will miss 3 to 4 games. Just hope he doesn’t have the “Ryan Church” type of concussion.

    Carlos Delgado…future hall of famer.

    If the Braves could trade Tex for Jackson, which is not happening and then get Bay too…now that would be AWESOME!!

  32. so guess what…lets go worst case here and Huddy needs TJ surgery. There goes our ace for next season. If they did surgery tomorrow, we’d be lucky to get him by Sept of next year and at that point whats the point. Stay with me here, worst case, Soriano’s elbow keeps acting up and he needs TJ surgery. There starts our 09 season the way this one did. Of course, worst case here.

    I dont care if we sell or buy or blow up the whole team, just get us to where we need to be to start next season.

  33. Kevin Lee,
    What c. shorter said. (Thanks, c. shorter.)

    I wasn’t trying to call him out, really. Just trying to see how credible his info was. I agree that I like having him around. I read his farewell message as temporary—as in, he had stuff to do today and wouldn’t be back for a while. I don’t think I offended him.

    If I did, I apologize. That was not my intent. Again, I was just trying to figure out whether I should put a lot of stock in his assessment of the Bay rumors.

  34. @36 The Yankees didn’t win because of ‘small ball’ or playing the way the national league does, whatever that means. They won because they had a lot of young talent that blossomed. Plus, they got a little lucky. By the late 90s, those great players were supplemented with some pricey free agents. Bunts, hit-and-runs, and whatever else counts as small ball were not the difference. Talent was.

    Bobby Cox’s managing has been a problem for the Braves this year. Managing, in the end, can make more of a difference in the clubhouse, it seems, and Bobby has obviously been wonderful in that regard. But the talent is now thinner. And Bobby’s in-game tactics have been exposed; his clubhouse presence can’t stop the bleeding. The harm begins with starting Jeff Francoeur every day, for the Braves, and almost every other club in the league, has a better option than a corner outfielder with a -11 VORP. The bullpen has likewise been badly managed and the effects, as Alex said, are becoming visible now. The platoons, the bunts, Francoeur: I’m sick of it too. Bobby is a contributing factor to the debacle that is this season.

  35. Also, let’s recall that the Braves were mediocre at the start of the season and are a little worse than mediocre now. The injuries have certainly played a part, but not much. Anyway. It’s not like most of these injuries have been a surprise, with the likes of Hampton, Smoltz, and Glavine on the preseason staff.

  36. Hudson is not going to need Tommy John. It seems pretty clear from the comment made that he’d be starting tonight if the Braves were in the thick of the division race.

  37. Marc Schneider,

    I have never said anything in a negative way about any of the players on the team. I have only mentioned facts and things you guys might find interesting. On top of this many of the things I have posted have happened in future events. There is nothing being “risked” by myself offering some insight to what is going on with the team.

    It seems as though most blogs (ajc, scout) have “experts” or “writers” who serve to let the bloggers know some inside information about the team. I am neither an “expert” or “writer” but do know many people inside the organization. It seemed as though the many Braves fans on this site would appreciate that. I do not know everything and never claimed to. Well this is my cue to move on. Enjoyed sharing some information and good luck everyone. Go Braves!!!

  38. It looks like unless there’s an injury before we need a 5th starter that Chuck James would be recalled. The Braves might recall him anyway instead of Reyes.

  39. Jeez, I hope someone got Jake’s belt and shoelaces on the way out.

    Goodbye Cruel Blog. *croak*

  40. Jake,
    It’s not that your info isn’t appreciated. For me, I’m a bit of an evidence guy—you know, the “show-me type”—so I’m often suspicious of folks’ motives if their cards aren’t on the table, that’s all.

    Adam
    You can call the Yankees’ 1996 success whatever you want. (Personally, I usually try to forget it.) I’m just telling you what their GM said they were trying to do from the beginning of the season.

    Of course, they had talent. They kept their young studs & spent a relative fortune acquiring others. But, compared to some of their other title teams, it was thin on starting pitching, strong of bullpen & that’s why Watson says he & Torre took the approach that Watson himself described as “NL ball.”

    Once again, Watson said it was their ongoing in-game strategy to take the lead early & try to keep it. That’s how he himself defined the term as it related to his team.

    It may not fit into a narrative some folks prefer, but I saw that team play a lot & I guarantee you they didn’t approach that season Weaver-style.

  41. lineups

    LF Blanco
    SS Escobar
    1B Teixiera
    CF Kotsay (huh? showcase?)
    2B Johnson
    3B Infante
    RF Francoeur
    C Sammons
    P Morton

    CF Schumaker
    2B Miles
    1B Pujols
    RF Ludwick
    3B Glaus
    C Molina
    LF Mather
    P Looper
    SS Izturis

  42. I’m fairly certain I’d have jumped ship and picked a new team to follow if you’d told me prior to the season that tonight’s lineup was going to be used at some point. I mean, it’s just…

  43. my lord, that lineup is like something from the mid 80’s.
    What happened with Jake? Did I miss something?

  44. What would be more hilarious is if we were playing in an AL park. Can you imagine Corky Miller, DH?

  45. hmmmmmmm………..try to get the lead and keep it??……….brilliant. no wonder Watson was a GM. i guess it was inevitable that Bobby gets the blame for this mess . all managers pull some strings and the ones that have good players succeed more than the others.

  46. Someone has to hit cleanup. Kotsay is a bad choice, but all the choices are bad. Teixeira is the only player in the lineup with more than nine homers. i probably would have hit KJ third and Teixeira fourth, but Kelly’s been struggling. It’s definitely a bad lineup, but not the worst the team has put out there in the last few years.

  47. oh, ububba………….i’ve seen dylan play a bunch of times, but i missed the Zevon covers. in fact the only cover tunes that come to mind were by Woody Guthrie and John Prine. i’ll keep trying.Zevon seems like a natural for Bob.

  48. FWIW, I heard this on a local AM sports talk station, saying the D’Backs and Braves close to this deal:

    Diamondbacks get:
    Tex
    Ohman

    Braves get:
    Tracy
    Scherzer/Parker
    another B level prospect

  49. Jake, I like knowing you have inside info and appreciate you sharing what you can

    If Tex is in any trade talks, Im really surprised to see him in the lineup. With our injury problems, it’ll be our luck if he goes down

  50. barry,
    Every time I see Dylan, I usually say, “OK, that’s it, the last time for him.” I love him & all, but the shows can be spotty.

    He rearranges the songs so dramatically that he’ll get half-way into a number, you’ll finally recognize it and say, “Oh…that’s ‘Blowing In the Wind.'” But then, he’ll break out something like the full-on “Desolation Row” or “Visions of Johanna” & I’m just slain. I go back.

    I did catch one of those Zevon-cover-fests at MSG a few years ago and, as a tribute to George Harrison, who had just passed, Bob ended with “Something.” It was one of those genuine moments that really touched people.

  51. Heard it on AM740 here, saw it on MLBtraderumors. I did a cut and paste because I’m way to lazy to type it myself…..

  52. @62, I’d be enthusiastic about adding Jarrod Parker, but not so much with Max Scherzer who’s just a reliever. As placeholders go, Tracy’s okay.

  53. Some other kook on the D’Backs scout site is claiming that a Teix/Ohman for Jackson/Scherzer deal is in place (with Teix being extended at 5 years and $120 million). That deal would be sweet but is clearly not happening.

  54. Parker’s a stud prospect. Tracy/Parker for Teix, while not my dream scenario, would certainly be better than keeping him and getting draft picks. I’d have thought—actually, I still think—Parker is off-limits.

  55. I’d take the Jackson for Text straight up – I might even throw in Ohman. Just get Jackson over here.

  56. Re: Dylan

    but the shows can be spotty.

    There’s an understatement. Ive seen Bob a few times, and he’s obviously a legend, who rightfully is above criticism…

    …but let’s be honest. The past few years, his show has become pretty embarassing, IMO. The last time I saw him in 04, the closest to playing an instrument he came was standing over his piano and arythmically banging out chords as he sodomized several of his classic songs. Vocal chops were never why you listened to Dylan, but man, it was embarassing.

    Then you take into consideration how damn expensive it is to see him…it’s about the worst concert bargain possible.

    Sorry Dylan fans.

  57. i hear ya, ububba. you never know what you’re gonna get. i’ve played “guess this tune” a few times too. my all-time favorite live Dylan moment came way back in the mid 70’s on the Rolling Thunder Revue tour. Bob and Mcguinn did tamborine Man together and obviously enjoying themselves, segued (sp?) into Chimes of Freedom. i was ready to sit there all night……. and the next time hes slumming around here, i’ll pay my money and take my chances.

  58. DOB:

    Just talked to Frank for a while. Said they have deals on the table right now if they want to pull trigger. Deals that Braves are holding off on because they want to see if they can do better.

    Seems to think the D’Backs and Angels are the two most likely destinations.

  59. I am on the verge of launching a Chad Tracy hate site. This guy is not a good player. His career numbers look good, but that is entirely a function of his ballpark. His career on-base percentage (again, the most important stat, by far) is .346. That looks okay, but it’s in a context where .346 is the league average — including pitchers. His career slugging percentage is .470, which is only a little above-average for Arizona. His numbers this year are inflated not only by the park but because he’s been hit-lucky.

    He has been hurt each of the last two seasons, which has taken away most of his value, since his value came because he used to be a pretty good third baseman. Of course, the Braves aren’t looking for a third baseman.

    He would be marginally useful anyway — if he wasn’t getting paid $4 million this year and about to make $5 million or so in arbitration next year. He’s a Wes Helms or Adam LaRoche type player, or a young Greg Norton, a player who is okay if you’re not paying him too much but will kill you if you are.

    Oh, and go to his B-R page and check out his fourth most-similar batter. Chills.

  60. #76 – Stu, I guess that would tell us all we need to know. We arent getting blown away by any teams looking at Tex and we might be better off taking the picks. Or Wren may just be playing the other GMs and getting them to add some other piece here in the next day or two

  61. I should clarify—just getting Parker, an elite pitching prospect, would be better than taking the draft picks, IMO. Tracy, as a place-holder, would just be gravy.

    FWIW, Tracy is actually under contract for $4.75 million next season and for a $7 million salary or $1 million buyout in 2010.

  62. Even worse. I would assume that the Braves would be bright enough to pay him to go away after hitting .265/.330/.420 in 2009, but this is an organization that thinks more highly of Jeff Francoeur than Kelly Johnson.

  63. Alright, here we go…

    barry,
    Ha, I only wish I’d seen those shows. (FYI–McGuinn joined Springsteen onstage & did those songs a few months ago at shows in Orlando & Tampa.) My first live Dylan experience was 1981 at Atlanta’s Fox Theater, while he was in his Jesus Phase. Good show, happy I saw it, just not exactly transcendent with the gospel backup singers and all.

    Douglass,
    Yup, Dylan fans know this better than anyone.

    FWIW, I believe Dylan had a circulation issue with his hands a few years ago, so he was reduced to playing piano. And yes, he was more croaky than Froggy from the “Little Rascals.”

    Another reason why I seem to keep going back is that I really liked his last 3 records & his band was pretty hot, especially the one with Charlie Sexton on lead guitar.

    But it’s a calculated risk seeing Dylan. You really gotta put up with the whatever-stuff to dig out those gems. But if you love him enough, there’s a decent chance you’ll find ’em.

  64. I’m certainly not “hating” on Dylan. (He is coming up on 70 after all.) I have all the respect in the world for him and all that he has done/written…as I said, he’s a living legend.

    It’s just as a guy who likes to see live music. I don’t think I’ve ever felt as ripped off as that last time I saw him in 2004. Not even the fact that it was Bob fuckin Dylan on stage could save that one. I continue to love his music, but I don’t think I will be subjecting myself nor my bank account to another incident like that one… :wink:

    (A pretty stark contrast to my man Neil Young, whos close to the same age. He’s aged like a fine wine. His live shows are still nothing short of incredible.)

  65. I dunno, He seems like he would be a useful guy fairly cheap. We really dont have anyone to plug into 3B when Chipper goes down. He can play 1st and the corner outfield. If we could get him plus Scherzer or Jackson, I would do that deal.

  66. No matter the circumstances, I hate losing to the Cardinals.

    Biggest Live Show Ripoff: George Jones, Armadillo Palace, Athens, Ga., 1983.

    I coughed up $15—a lotta dough for a college sophomore.

    George made us wait nearly 2 hours for him to show up & he played 30 minutes, including “He Stopped Loving Her Today” twice.

    As soon as his manager got the check, George cut out the back on a motorcyle and was headed out on the Atlanta Highway. The band kept playing & the place nearly rioted when they realized he wasn’t coming back.

    The fans went outside, began to circle & rock the tour bus, until someone in the band came out & told ’em that George was long gone.

    It was crazy, but for 30 minutes I got to see “No Show” Jones.

  67. Scherzer is just a reliever. Again, there is no point in trading Teixeira for spare parts, much less spare parts that make $4.75 million next year. And obviously they aren’t going to trade both Tracy and Jackson.

  68. Hah, that George Jones story got a serious chuckle out of me. Buncha angry college kids rioting outside a tourbus as George Jones escapes on a motorcycle. That’s funny shit.

  69. On the radio before the game, Bobby said that Huddy would take off a couple of weeks. He also didn’t speak very highly of Jo-Jo Tickle, saying he needed to get command of the strike zone in the minors. It sounds like he’s going to be down for a while.

  70. I’m glad I officially gave up on the season yesterday,otherwise I might be completely offended to see Charlie Morton! starting.

  71. Francoeur is digging his nose, a wild dog just got onto the field, and the mosquito spray-truck just rode by so the whole place stinks…but the team is going to Dairy Queen after the game omgyay!!!1

  72. Well in our defense…look at the lineup.

    We’ve got well over 50% of our payroll on the DL.

  73. “Just talked to Frank for a while. Said they have deals on the table right now if they want to pull trigger. Deals that Braves are holding off on because they want to see if they can do better.”

    DO IT, JS.

    Unless by better, he means better players instead of playing better.

  74. The bottom line on ESPN had something about Tex by Jayson Stark, but I missed most of it.

  75. just wondering but why do you say he’s just a reliever?

    he’s got 8 starts between AAA and MLB this year

    his total line for the year is

    60IP 45H 26BB 79K

  76. The Bad News Braves.

    Douglass,
    Oh, they weren’t college kids. There might’ve been 10 UGA students out of a crowd of 1,500.

    Most of those people were from outside the Athens perimeter—Oconee, Elbert, Jackson, Barrow counties. It was their big night out and they were blind-drunk & blind-angry.

  77. Is Chuck James still alive? It seems like it might be time to try him out again. Reyes and Morton aren’t working.

  78. Ron, Chuckie pitched last friday. Im sure we might have a Chuck/Morton swap after today

  79. I’m glad I never drank the Charlie Morton! Kool-Aid. I still don’t see, looking at his minor league statistics, what the big deal about this guy is (was?). What’s Charlie Morton! done to justify all the people calling him a future #1 starter?

  80. There we go, Braves inform teams of plans to trade Tex, according to Tony Stark – via the Bottom Line on FarveSPN.

  81. It said “Braves inform teams that they plan to trade 1B Mark Teixiera”….that’s basically it. How is that news?

  82. You know, I hadn’t thought of this before, but isn’t McCann’s concussion really Francoeur’s fault for making that throw? If he’d airmailed it like he usually does, Brian would have been chasing the ball instead of getting hit.

  83. Kind of early to pass judgement on Charlie Morton either way.

    If you looked at his numbers, you saw that he was a much different pitcher in the last year. Our scouts believe there is a sustainable reason. Got to give him a chance to adjust.

    We did give Davies two and a half years which now appears to be not quite long enough.

  84. Who called Charlie Morton a future #1?

    I don’t think I’ve ever read that anywhere…especially here.

  85. I saw where Jorge Posada is out for the year; do the Yankees have anybody left that we would be interested in?

  86. I would guess the “news” is just another step closer to an actual deal being done, like the DOB info.

  87. I think that the idea was that Morton has the kind of stuff that makes you think he could be a #1 down the road. Maybe. At any rate, he was, like every other starting prospect of the last few years, rushed before he’d had a chance to succeed in the upper minors for more than a few starts.

  88. Oh, and the Cards are supposedly one of the teams interested in Ohman, which given LaRussa’s proclivities isn’t surprising. (I enjoyed phrasing his use of multiple lefthanded relievers in a way that made him look like a pervert, by the way.) So I guess you could scout some of the guys currently killing us.

  89. Mac, Joe just pointed out how Francoeur’s been airmailing his throws home . . . except for the one yesterday where McCann got hurt. Apologies if you’re watching the game, but I’m not sure where it’s being broadcast.

  90. these guys have a much better chance of overtaking the Nats for last place than catching anyone in front of them.

  91. You’re right, it’s baseball – No Pepper.

    He’s at least the Iron Horse though.

    The Iron Horse of Philly baseball journalists? No?

  92. Mac, Tracy is a step above Helms in my opinion and is an awful defensive first baseman at this point, he really hasn’t ever played first at all in his career except for this year. He is nothing more than a league average player if you’re going to put him at first, I’ll agree with that, but the Braves don’t have any of those currently in the minors. I still don’t think he’s healthy by the way.

    Anyway, Scherzer and Parker would both be much more than spare parts in my book. I can’t believe they would give up either of those guys but they may be forced to part with one of them if the market dictates it. I think both could be solid #2/3 starters. Scherzer may end up in relief, but if he did, he has dominant closer written all over him.

  93. Scherzer = spare part
    Parker = not

    Parker and Tracy I’d do, but to be honest I’d try to flip Tracy after the season before everyone realizes he’s a walking park effect. Tracy and Scherzer, no way. I think that the comparison to Norton is probably closest for Tracy. Tracy is a lefthanded hitter who should be platooned but hasn’t, and Norton is a “switch-hitter” who can’t hit righthanded, the effect is the same. Tracy hits for a higher average, Norton walked more, but it evens out.

  94. If Jackson is playing left because of a hurt Eric Byrnes, then how about this trade:

    Tex/Jeffy for Jackson
    or
    Tex/Jeffy/Ohman for Jackson/Good SP prospect

    Jeffy could go into LF/RF for them; of course, this all hinges on Arizona thinking Jeffy just needs a change of scenery.

  95. Phillip,
    Molina is going to be the Yanks’ catcher for the rest of the year. He can’t hit—although he’s pitched in with a couple game-winners so far—but he’s got an unbelievable arm & superquick release. Now that they have Nady, the bottom of their order isn’t so dead now.

    The only Yankee players we might want & could afford are the young pitchers that Cashman refuses to part with—Hughes, Horn, Kennedy.

    Hughes is hurt, but he can be a stud—awesome stuff when he’s on; haven’t seen Horn pitch; and I remain unconvinced with Kennedy. The Yankee Talk on Kennedy is that he’s mentally soft, doesn’t handle adversity well.

    Edwar Ramirez has become a good middle-inning guy, who can get lefties out, but they aren’t giving him up. I don’t really see them as a Tex trading partner, if that’s what you meant. And they just got Marte, so Ohman is probably out, too.

  96. A guess I don’t have a good definition for ‘spare part’ but guys with Scherzer’s K rate don’t grow on trees. I’d be happy to get him.

  97. Mac,

    While I agree that I want no part of a Tracy/Scherzer deal, why are you so low on Scherzer? I’m asking honestly because I trust your opinion and I haven’t studied him as a propsect at all. But everything I’ve read and heard about the kid this year seems to hold him in much higher regard than “spare part.” Big time + fastball, solid enough change, needs to develop more of a slider, but many scouting reports seem to think he could do just that. Is there a particular reason you’re low on him?

  98. Everything I’ve read on Scherzer says that the scouts think he’ll be in the bullpen. He throws harder than Chuck James, but has a similar issue — he really just has a fastball. It’s a terrific fastball and the “heavy” type that the Braves love, but without a quality second pitch, or really any third pitch he can do anything with… Well, like the scouts, that spells bullpen to me.

  99. This game is pretty much a picture perfect recreation of the first 20 minutes of Major League.
    And Joe Simpson just started singing a Toby Keith song. The locusts are descending on the Ted.

  100. chief nocahoma,

    Pitchers can get hurt just as easily at 22 as at 32; as a matter of fact, they are probably more likely to get hurt at 22. Hudson is barely on the other side of 30 and lots of pitchers pitch effectively into their late 30s/40s (remember John Smoltz?) If you want to say they should have traded Hudson because the season is over and see what they can get, that’s one thing, but to say he’s too old and likely to get hurt makes no sense.

  101. There are also some durability questions (not that he has shown problems yet, but that they think there will be problems) and he throws from a low 3/4 angle, and that means he’ll likely be vulnerable to lefties, especially if he doesn’t have a changeup.

  102. Fair enough. Come to think of it, most of those scouting reports I read about his second and third pitch being adequate/having potential were written before his debut this year. I agree that a bigtime fastball with no other + pitch sounds like bullpen material.

  103. Cary, I can’t even begin to tell you how inflated McPherson’s numbers are. The Isotopes park, while one of the best in the minors is basically Citizens Bank with altitude and a hill in center field. It’s 400 to dead center for example. He’s basically Mike Jacobs playing in AAA. He would be a last resort cheap option in my book. I don’t see a ton of difference between him and Thorman in my opinion.

  104. Not that it really matters at this point in the season, but they should be more worried about getting Glavine back on the mound rather than in the booth.

    btw, please no Chad Tracy–too expensive for his mediocrity

  105. Pete just said on the radio that Wren is having a press conference to announce bad news about Hudson’s elbow.

  106. The guy hitting behind the pitcher just drove one in.

    Mac, might as well write the recap.

  107. 157–hope Huddy isn’t headed for TJ–that would royally suck b/c it’d take him out of the picture for most of next season

  108. I bet there were some rednecks at that George Jones show from Madison County, too, my beautiful and backwards originating county. I can imagine four-plus Madison Countians jammed side-by-side on an old Ford pickup three-seat bench seat, driving down highway 29 to Athens.

    I guess that’s kind of out of left field, but I couldn’t miss my opportunity to make Madison County famous on the world-wide internets.

  109. Mac, about Scherzer, I would rather have Parker, but Scherzer is a potential lights out late inning relief guy in the Joba Chamberlain mold, which to me is more than a spare part.

  110. Oh man, what next? Really, what else could we expect? A ten year contract for Frenchy could be the only worse news.

  111. By the way, I saw George Jones last year in Marietta and he put on a pretty good show. He also hocked his cds, his sausages, and his bottled water–“White Lightning Bottled Water.” But he did sing for a lot longer than 30 minutes. He sang some of his songs, including “He Stopped Loving Her” in a medley near the end. Good show, though. I saw Dylan and Elvis Costello around that time as well, since we’re talking about it. Or were, at least. Costello was good. Dylan was ok. He did play guitar, which was neat.

  112. Tracy is only useful if we have a need to field a roughly average or better 1B. If Hudson happens to be missing most of next year, that’s not really a concern to me if it’s my team, unless we add 2 or 3 impact types in the offseason to offset (likely) Tex, (also) Smoltz, and (potentially) Huddy.

  113. Uh-oh.

    The Braves are going to need to get not one, but TWO top-of-the-rotation starters this offseason.

  114. I feel like elbow stiffness/pain portends TJ more often than not these days. Soriano’s next.

  115. If Huddy is out for through ’09, I have no confidence that this team will ever contend again.

    Is it Atlanta sports in general?

  116. Stu, I like it – a little catchier, a little fresher in the baseball lexicon, a lot less complimentary.

  117. Boog says Hudson headed to Birmingham to see Dr. Andrews. He implied it’s more of an exam than surgery at this point.

  118. Next year’s rotation: Jair Jurrjens, Jo-Jo Reyes, Charlie Morton, Jeff Bennett, and Chuck James.

    Buckle up folks.

  119. 178–doubtful b/c the Braves have $50 million plus of expiring contracts to use for FA

    of course it’d be better not to use the $$$ for a Huddy replacement and to have the $$$ for, say, a new RF and a 1B replacement

  120. Wren to announce Tommy John elbow surgery for Hudson and Soriano, a trade of Teixeira and Ohman for Chad Tracy and an 8-year deal for Francoeur.

    Just get it all over with at once. End the pain.

  121. More MRI results (from Boog): new ligament damage and reaggravation of an old problem.

  122. If we make this a save situation, guess it’ll be Izzy now. I need to drop Franklin, he’s kind of a gas can recently.

  123. These are the times that lead men to take hostages. What else can go wrong? I feel like Jurrjens, Escobar, and KJ should all go on the DL just to be safe, but they’d probably get hit by foul balls in the dugout.

  124. The Cards are talking about bringing Wainwright back as a closer. I think this makes them stupid, but that’s just me.

  125. Tell the Angels and D’Backs if they Take Hudson and his salary, they can have Teix and Ohman for nothing.

    The next couple of seasons are really going to suck.

  126. Ha so I guess Thorman on Team Canada means we don’t get to see him hustle down the first base line on all of his ground outs to second base

  127. Tracy had a .911 OPS and 27 HR and batted .308 as late as 2005. That’s about all our A+ level OF combined for about two seasons. Give me Tracy, Scherzer and Parker and call it a season. Flip Ohman to the Cards for a AA power arm and call it a season.

  128. Only 8 runs down now!
    At least Hudson’s injury makes the need to get major league-ready guy(s) for Teix a dead issue.

  129. Out of curiosity, if they don’t get back a 1B, then who would play 1B for the rest of the season? Will they move KJ over there and play Prado at 2B and Infante at 3B?

  130. Tommy John surgery, known by doctors as ulnar collateral ligament reconstruction. Not good when that’s exactly what Wren mentioned. Sad

    Maybe we’ll view getting Hudson back next August as our “trade deadline” deal without giving anything up?

  131. @195

    Norton, batting cleanup, I’m sure.

    Is Roberto Petagine still alive?

    What about Julio?

  132. Hey, if they’d give us all three, I’d be ecstatic. But Tracy is not a good player. He’s all park effects. In Atlanta, he’d put up the same sort of numbers LaRoche did, but for a whole lot more money and with much worse defense.

  133. Surely there’s a AAAA-no upside whatsoever basher that we could trade for for peanuts that could fill the role for the rest of the year

  134. Surely they could have filled RF with one of those guys too, so color me skeptical.

  135. I was about 3, maybe 4 weeks off on my prediction, but after tonight the Braves will be 8.5 games out if my math serves me correctly. I was predicting 9 games out back at the end of June or the first part of July with the race being out of reach. With Chipper and Huddy on the DL for at least another 12 days or so which has already been spoken about at length, this team is done. Time to plan for next year. Will Chipper even qualify for the batting title if this crap keeps up?

    By the way, prediction on end of season record: 75-87

  136. I’m thinking 70-92 at this rate. We will struggle to literally win a game with this cast of characters. Shows just how bereft the farm system is when literally you’re not excited about 1 callup.

  137. Games like this is when I really miss Skip, because he’s funny when the score is so lopsided.

  138. Chipper has already won the batting title of my heart.

    I don’t think that came out right.

  139. 205 – Skip’s on the radio. Hasn’t had any jokes about how he wishes he was drunk yet that I’ve heard though.

  140. But, he did comment on Ohman’s impression of his dad, and said he was going to ask him “What do I do, I got a girl pregnant?”

  141. Ring, great, Cards will get at least two more

    If I wanted to see baseball this pathetic I’d have put the Bad News Bears on my netflix queue

  142. If we loose Huddy for the next season and a half, wouldnt starting pitching quickly become a priority….maybe change what kind of package we look for in a Tex deal?

  143. Remember when Ring was the anti-Grybo early in the year?

    How long ago and far away that time seems now…

  144. Maybe we can get a touchdown, recover the onside kick, and get a field goal to tie it.

  145. I recall Wren saying a while back that the Braves were no longer looking for a starter, even with Smoltz shut down. Lost in everyone’s (understandably) depressed haze is the fact that even if Hudson was healthy all season, the bottom had already fallen off the Braves rotation. Reyes and Morton have been HORRIBLE over the past three or four weeks. Campillo’s season is also unsustainable.

    The point: they should probably have been looking for pitching already. They did just score 27 runs in a series in which they lost two of three.

  146. Take Teixeira out. With the way the season is going, he’s going to pull up lame running to second on a double.

  147. LOL at that yuppie Cardinal fan doing the twist…

    that’s my kind of comedy.

    (the unintentional variety….always funnier to laugh at someone than with them… :twisted: )

  148. This just in from that Stark article:

    “‘The only difference,’ Teixeira said, ‘is that last year, I was kind of ready to move on from Texas. … But this year, I really want to stick it out with the Braves and see if we can make a run.”

    You know, it might have been nice to hear this from you when we still looked like we might have a chance earlier in the year. Instead, all we heard is how you were in Atlanta now and no one knew what would happen after that. Way to be a team player, a few months late.

  149. At this point, if Huddy is out next year, I saw gut the team!

    And thats not being irrational, or rediculous, its just, who is going to pitch for us next year?

    We will have Chipper at third, who as great as he is, sadly cant play 3/4s of a season.

    We will have no rotation, we will lose tex,

    so we should trade and go young, and see if we cant get it moving that way

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