Phillies 4, Braves 1

ESPN – Phillies vs. Braves – Box Score – July 03, 2008

This team depresses me.

I considered stopping there. But to sum up — Jair Jurrjens gave up eight hits in seven innings while walking one, which isn’t too bad, but three of the hits were solo homers and he threw in a double and a triple. Still, he gave a normal team a chance to win. This team, however, is rapidly taking on the personality of its supposed face, Jeff Francoeur, who sucks.

The Braves had exactly one scoring chance of note in the first eight innings, when Infante singled and McCann walked leading off the second. Guess who was up next? Amazingly, the Out Machine only popped out, but the next two guys also popped out, so threat negated.

Chipper had a one-out double in the ninth, and with two out McCann doubled him in. Whoopee. The Phillies went to their pen for the easiest save situation in world history, and the Out Machine popped out on the first pitch. He sucks. This team doesn’t suck as much as he does, but it’s getting there.

Kelly Johnson, who it hitting well over .300 against lefties, sat, while Francoeur, who sucks, and who couldn’t hit if you told him what was coming and where, played and gave his usual 0-4. I hate him.

On the positive side, Ohman and Gonzalez each had a strong inning. Didn’t really matter.

90 thoughts on “Phillies 4, Braves 1”

  1. so who deserves most of the blame?

    A. Jeff for sucking
    B. Bobby for continuing to play him everyday

    can we please become sellers at this point? call up Brandon and Schafer. trade off Kotsay, Ohman, Ring, and Tex, release the Hamster/Hampton/ and Glavine, send Acosta and Jeff back to Richmond, call up Stockman, Perry, and Sammons,

  2. There are plenty of other faces culpable in this mess, and there probably are no better alternatives in Richmond, but sometimes a move must be made to set an example and rouse the team out of slumber — and that move has to be sending Francoeur to Richmond.

    Ours is the most listless team in the sport, and it’s time to start pressing buttons — even if they’re random — to shake this thing up.

  3. I can support this team when they suck but are trying…but sucking AND not trying is a lot to ask your fans to get behind.
    Someone, ANYONE, change something. It’s the same…exact…thing…every…single…day.

  4. The team might actually be able to reach .500 again this season if the rally-killer was sent down. I really believe that.

    Make the playoffs? No. But be .500? I think so. Francoeur seemingly comes up in every big scoring chance and always fails.

  5. It’s really getting absurd. They’ve tried letting Francoeur work his way out of this “slump,” but it’s not working. Send him down, and let him work for a while with less day-to-day pressure on him.

  6. So, the Braves are a half game closer to last place than first place. I think that bit of information sums it all up. The next Braves-Nats series should be interesting.

    As for Francoeur, if this incredibly horrible slump goes on much longer without consequence from Braves management, I’ll seriously begin to question the direction of this “gold standard” organization. A young player can’t have a slump like this and not face the consequences of not performing. If Kelly Johnson were doing this, his locker would have been cleaned out a long, long time ago.

  7. On to 2009! I like our chances as long as Crappy McTonsofouts doesn’t make the team.

  8. Seems like it’s time to pack it in.

    Normally, 7 games back with the talent we supposedly have and half a season to go, we would have a chance. But, if the team we are chasing owns this much, I don’t see any way.

  9. Also, Richmond had 14 hits tonight, but the guys everyone wants to call up, Perry and Sammons, had 0-fers.

  10. Apparently, according to some other message boards, Bobby said “Francoeur is our right fielder. That’s that.” If that is true, he needs to go as well.

  11. Sat in section 139 behind number 7…oour fans are idiots..they still love this guy…number 7 jersey sales rule this team, time to realize its about money not wins fellas

  12. I talked to someone close to the Richmond Braves today and they said Francouer, if demoted, would not go to Richmond. More than likely Mississippi. FWIW

  13. The more I watch this team, the more I’m convinced it is the MLB reincarnation of the 2000 UGA football team. Playing the part of Quincy Carter you have Jeff Francoeur, who had everyone pegging him as a future Hall of Hamer/Heisman Trophy winner during his rookie season (2005)/freshman season (1998). Unfortunately, he peaked out that season and began a fairly slow decline, culiminating in a 2-21 clip with the bases loaded/ a 5-interception performance against South Carolina. Donnan eventually sat Carter due to a “thumb injury.” Will Cox do the same?

    Speaking of which, playing the part of Jim Donnan we have Bobby Cox. Although I don’t think Bobby would ever do anything as stupid as hiring Kevin Ramsey as defense coordinator.

  14. Depressing is a good word for it, Mac. Last night at the game I watched JF”K” destroy ever scoring opportunity that we had.

    I think the 0-fer tonight has GOT to be his ticket to Richmond. I mean what else can we do that hasn’t been tried with this kid?

    Jurrjens wasn’t on but when you have some run support, you can be in the thick of a game like this and even come back.

    It’s been tough to watch.


  15. I think the Braves will not be able to make the changes they need to make until Bobby is no longer managing. No way that Wren can do anything that Bobby doesn’t want and Bobby apparently will never admit that Francoeur sucks. (Do I understand correctly that Rob Neyer said that Frenchy is just unlucky based on stats? Neyer reminds me of one of Whiz Kids in the Pentagon in the 60s that came up with the concept of body counts that worked so well in Viet Nam. In other words, he is addicted to numbers without any kind of context or analysis. To me it’s plainly ridiculous to think that Francouer is simply being unlucky. I find Neyer increasingly annoying.)

    The Braves have to do something–either buy or sell. If they stand pat, the only people coming to see the team will be the teeny boppers fantasizing about Francouer.

  16. Ya know, I like the organization sticking behind a young player like this. After what they did to Devine and what they’re doing to Stockman, I’m glad they’re not burying him in AAA to never return again. I also like that to the media (who, by the way, doesn’t need to freaking know everything going on in the clubhouse), Bobby simply says he’s the right fielder. Bobby does a good job of not fueling anything because, duh, he is the right fielder. Their apparent philosophy of letting him work it out at the major league level has been done many times by many teams with great success.

    I know we’re frustrated that he’s the worst player in the league right now that’s still giving him consistent at-bats. Trust me, I am too. But it’s not like Diaz/Kotsay/Jones is going to be that much better than Jones/Kotsay/Francouer with Norton/Infante thrown somewhere in each of those scenarios, and Norton/Infante will both play more if Frenchy gets shipped.

    It seems like we’re so dadgum pissed off because we’re losing and he’s the worst player that we just want him gone even though that’s really not going to help the team that much. If we had someone to call up who could hold his own for a little while, that’d be one thing. But we’re trading Francouer for more at-bats of Diaz/Norton/Infante and, really, that’s not much of an upgrade. It’s not gonna get us scoring runs in bunches or turning around this huge slide. It seems like we’re just looking for a scapegoat so we can have someone to blame.

  17. Marc,

    What the FRICK do you want Bobby to say? He said Jeff was the right fielder and that was that. Do you want him to come out and say, “Jeff is an absolutely horrible player right now. He’s killing us, and I wish I could kill him.” Bobby’s biggest strength is getting the most out of players, and bashing Jeff in the media (which is what you’re asking) is not going to help him AT ALL. You just want to hear someone state the incredibly obvious: he sucks right now. But why? Bobby knows it, Wren knows it, JS knows it, so why state the obvious and potential embarrass and deflate a dude that, according to everyone that’s had a quote in the paper about the situation, has been working his tail off to get better. My goodness man, for such an intelligent guy, you really ask for some ridiculous stuff sometimes.

  18. Their apparent philosophy of letting him work it out at the major league level has been done many times by many teams with great success.

    I dare you to find me a corner outfielder who has been aloud to suck this badly and play every single game for three straight seasons. Good luck.

    Many times by many teams my a**.

  19. 1) Most players don’t play every single game for three straight seasons, regardless of performance.

    2) Very few corner outfielders have sucked this badly period. What’s your point?

    3) The original point was that struggling players are given the opportunity to play their way through struggles all the time, and it works out a lot. Are you really arguing that? It happens all the time.

  20. FWIW, Kelly Johnson started out 1-29 or something. At least Francouer has both minor league and major league track records of success. I’m glad we let KJ work it out…

  21. Happy 4th of July to everyone who comes to this nice site!

    Now, lets hope that the second half of the summer treats the Braves better….

  22. Re: Neyer, I didn’t read the whole column (I’m not an ESPN insider), but even so I’m willing to concede that it’s a silly point. Still, it’s not completely bonkers. Francoeur’s a terrible player, yes, but he’s not this bad. If you look at the numbers, it seems pretty clear that he actually has been getting unlucky on top of playing terribly, so his performance has been even worse. He’d still suck even if he was performing as well as the numbers say he should be, but not quite this egregiously.

    JC, what is Francoeur’s PrOPS?

  23. I think there’s a chance that when Diaz gets back that Francoeur will be sent down. They’ll have to make some sort of move, and it would be nonsensical to send Blanco down.

  24. @11, I’d take the Nats outfield over ours every day of the week and twice on Sundays.

    Elijah Dukes has legit power and speed and as good an arm as Francouer. He can be a 30/30 or maybe even 40/40 All-Star. The main thing that young players usually are missing is plate discipline and the man has it. Even with his well-documented problems, I’d trade Francouer straight up for Dukes right now and laugh all the way to the bank.

    Besides, here are Dukes’ June stats to get my back:

    .292 avg/.395 obp/.481 slg/.876 ops/4 HR/5 SB in 106 ABs with 16 BB:30 Ks

    That alone puts the Nats over the top, but aside from that Lastings Milledge has more talent and potential than anyone in our Outfield. He’s capable of being Carl Crawford plus some added power as he matures and he’s already on pace for 15 HRs and 30 SBs.

    Okay, so Wily Mo Pena will never get it and Austin Kearns is done, but that still gives the Nats 2/3 of a future OF to our zero (obviously we have great OF prospects in the minors in Heyward, Schafer and Gorkys Hernandez).

    So it’s not even particularly close. The Nats also have 3B (Ryan Zimmerman) and Catcher (Jesus Flores) set and a fair amount of young pitching rising in the minors. They’ll come up quickly in our rearview mirror in a couple years. We better be ready.

  25. Mac–You may be right. However, Bob Walk’s observation about the fans (which echoes jj3bagger’s ocmment from an earlier thread) suggests that the average fan had yet to reach the love and admiration that we have for Frenchy on the site. Therefore, I think that the Braves will indeed be wary of sending Frenchy to Richmond.

    I think to worry about the extent to which he is terrible is really to head towards a distinction without a difference…

    Of course, I think all of us know that he shouldn’t be this bad, but then again–the Prince of Suckage, the Out Machine–is a really bad player.

  26. “Bill Shanks is reporting the Braves have sent Jeff Francoeur to AA and will recall Jason Perry to Atlanta.”

  27. I can’t sleep… but will give it a try again soon. Maybe we’ll have confirmation (one way or the other) before I do.

    Perry would be a temp, unless he’s lights-out, because Diaz is supposedly close. I guess maybe they couldn’t wait any longer.

  28. I mean… this is exciting, right? I’m so sick of hearing that the Braves won’t deal with Francoeur because the fans are idiots or Bobby’s delusional. Winning is the only bottom line.

    As for comparisons to KJ, Francoeur has never shown the plate discipline Johnson did–and that counts the slump KJ endured when he first came up in 2005. Also, Johnson really only stuck because he moved to 2B. Francoeur has been a bad bad hitter for three years now–this is his second season below replacement level –and it’s annoying that it took this slump for folks to recognize it. At best, he’s bad. At worst, he’s perhaps the worst regular in the league.

  29. If true, talk about a Friday news dump! A holiday weekend even, when most folks are too busy to notice. +1 PR department.

  30. SOP here is that nothing is considered confirmed until either Peanut or DOB (or Carroll) reports it, or there’s a press release. Shanks has been wrong a lot.

  31. Honestly, I don’t hate Frenchy, but the kid really needs some fresh air and start having fun with the game again. He will not have any success if he keeps on pressing like that. I don’t care who they are calling up because I want nothing but success for Frenchy. Spending a little time in the minor is probably the best thing for him now.

  32. I think that we all have been frustrated with Frenchy; however, assuming Shanks has it right, I would certainly want him to spend enough time to learn something about plate discipline. I would hope that the Braves envision more than a change of scenery for Frenchy. After all, he is still young and has significant potential….

  33. Teaching plate discipline has never been the Braves’ minor league system strength. It’s either the player has it or not…

  34. IIRC, Perry’s not on the 40 man, so the Braves would have to move Smoltz or someone to the 60 day DL.

  35. Because I was bored, and really because I was looking for an excuse to work on my Access skills, I ran a little study to try and see how many players, who at age 24 and with at least 4 years’ MLB service at that time, had a season as bad as Francoeur is having right now. For the sake of argument, I just assumed Francoeur wouldn’t improve any this season, probably unfair but then again this study is anything but scientific. Anyway, in the history of baseball I found 299 such players- I didn’t sort by position so this includes everyone except pitchers. I used runs created/27 outs as the basis for how bad Francoeur has been since I could easily calculate that, and the Lahman database didn’t have anything like OPS+ so I didn’t have any stats relative to the league; Francoeur is at 3.6 RC/27 right now.

    Of those 299, exactly 23 went on to have, at some point in their career, what I loosely defined as a median season for an outfielder- median being 5.5 RC/27- in a season of at least 350 AB’s. Obviously that cutoff point is arbitrary but for these 23, a RC/27 of 5.5 roughly equated to an OPS of 780 or so, which doesn’t seem unreasonable to expect from a RF; this season the NL average RF OPS is 784 so it seems to pass the smell test.

    At any rate, if you could make predictions from this study, which you probably can’t, then you wouldn’t like Francoeur’s 7.7% odds of ever having even one season where he hit like an average right fielder. Probably a bad time to post this, with the holiday coming up and everyone (including me) going away and not checking this site as much, but hopefully this will shine a little light on what to expect from him in the future.

    And just in case anyone cares, here are the 23 players who did “turn it around,” at least once:

    Jay Bell; Ollie Brown; Jose Cardenal; Roger Cedeno; George Foster; Bill Freehan; Gene Freese; Willie Greene; Brian Harper; Toby Harrah; Larry Herndon; Larry Hisle; Todd Hundley; Don Money; Darrell Porter; Aramis Ramirez; Benito Santiago; Steve Sax; Paul Schaal; Gary Thomasson; Willie Upshaw; Lee Walls; Claudell Washington.

    Have a happy 4th.

  36. AAR,

    Frenchy’s PrOPS is around .740. I looked it up the other day. I’m out of town and using dial-up, and it takes forever to look it up at THT. Remember, this is a cumulative stat. I think he WAS unlucky for part of the season, but he has responded to the bad luck (which he should have ignored) because I’ve never seen Frenchy look that bad. He may not be a star, but he normally doesn’t miss hangers over the plate.

    If Shanks is reporting Frenchy is going down, it’s either true or someone hacked BS’s site as a joke. Shanks would have to fight through the tears to write such a story.

  37. I am surprised that neither the AJC nor Peanut has reported this yet.

    Also, I wanted to add that though Frenchy has been unlucky, a mid-700s OPS is enough to justify a demotion. .660 just makes it easier.

  38. RE: Rohrbough

    I heard that he was going to the DL last week (Shanks).

    Yes, I think he is still injured.

  39. AJC has it:

    The Braves have sent Jeff Francoeur to AA Mississippi where they hope he can work through his struggles that have dropped his batting average to .234. In Mississippi he can work with manager Phillip Wellman, with whom he’s had a close relationship in the past.

    …Fletcher said Francoeur would be flying to Mississippi this afternoon and could be in the lineup in Mississippi as early as tonight.

  40. AJC says Frenchie to Mississippi. Let’s hope there is a purpose to this move, and that he watches Kaaihue in every AB (although watching Chipper certainly has not helped Frenchie). Braves organization needs to do well here; get a hitting coach who can help Frenchie with his pitch recognition and strike zone judgment, or the results will be the same when he comes back.

  41. Thanks Rissa….Rohrbough’s numbers have been painful to watch.

    George Foster, Bill Freehan, Jose Cardenal, Larry Hisle…we should be so lucky….

  42. Thanks Parish–The info on Rohrbough makes sense. Between Rohrbough, Evarts and Barrett, our best pitching prospects at Rome have reallly been cursed in 2008. I really hope that the Braves can figure out whats wrong with Rohrbough and help him get back on track before the end of the season….

  43. “oh happy day”

    Thats pretty sad, lets all hope Jeff the best because whether you like it or not the braves need a good Jeff Francoeur. There are no replacements for him.

  44. Jeff, you’re right in that the Braves need a good Jeff Francoeur to contend. But there is no good Jeff right now, and the bad Jeff absolutely murders the offense.

    At least the Astros also aren’t any good right now. Let’s get a few wns and get back on our feet.

  45. “I do not agree with this, but I have to do what I have to do,” Francoeur told the AJC in a text message Friday morning – From the AJC

  46. Jason Perry was called up. His numbers this year:

    AA: 43-for-137 (.314), 11 2B, 2 3B, 13 HR, 41 RBI, 23 BB, 44 SO, .423 OBP, .708 SLG, 1.131 OPS

    AAA: 32-for-106 (.302) 5 2B, 5 HR, 14 RBI, 12 BB, 27 SO, .398 OBP, .491 SLG, .889 OPS

    He’s 27 years old, 6’0”, 200 lbs., bats left, throws right. Whenever he makes the field, it will be his major league debut–he’s been toiling in the minor leagues since 2002.

  47. “This has really put a damper on my relationship with the Atlanta Braves,” Francoeur told the AJC.

    Woah, a tad bitchy, isn’t he?

  48. Wow, he’s handling it like a baby. That’s really disappointing. Maybe the franchise won’t be bound to him forever after all.

    Once again, though, how lucky are the Braves that he twice turned down long-term contracts?

  49. From the ajc article:

    A statement released Friday morning by Braves team spokesman Brad Hainje said: “It was discussed with Jeff that this move will allow him to get at-bats in a less pressurized environment. Francoeur will re-join the major league club following the upcoming All-Star break.”

    Uh, in case you didn’t notice, the All-Star break is over on July 18th when we play at home against the Nationals. Everyone who thinks Frenchy will regain his swing over the course of two weeks, raise your hand! Yeah, I thought no one was raising their hand….

    Just check out Rufaro’s post (#48) for a dose of reality on this portion of the conversation.

    I really hope Jeff figures out his swing (as in, MAKE IT A TAD MORE COMPACT) down in Mississippi, but anyone who thinks his ship is going to right itself in two weeks should send me some of the kool-aid they’re drinking.

  50. The story doesn’t say much about why he’s bitching, exactly, other than wishing they would have given him advance notice that they were considering the move. That seems fair enough, but he absolutely can’t argue the fact that he’s stunk up the joint this year.

  51. The quote in #64 is very telling as to why he stinks. He’s a primadonna and won’t accept coaching or responsibility for his own failure. That’s a bad combination.

  52. How could he not know they were considering it? He’s been terrible all season. His failures with men in scoring position probably accounts for at least 5 losses the team has endured. Literally, no one in the entire organization could do worse than he’s done over the last month or so. Again, how dense must he be to not know this was a possibility.

    I can only hope Jeff will continue to protect the Braves from themselves by being so consistently stupid.

  53. Remember, he is still young, and is wearing the emotions on his sleeves. Of course he is upset. Im sure he is upset with himself, his swings, his performance and a host of other things.

    Prepackaged athletes give prepackaged comments all the time. The guy is hitting horribly, and he just found out he is going down to double a, im sure he wasnt thrilled.

    Everyone here would love him to say, well i accept this demotion becasue ive been doing terrible.

    But he is hurt, and he said what he feels.

    I just hope he gets it going, if we are gonna make a playoff push, we need a productive frenchy, otherwise deal his ass, and we will move on

  54. Playoff push, we’ll finish closer to last in the East than pushing for the playoffs. Are you kidding me?


    And my response to Francoeur’s whining is a big **** YOU! Who do you think you are to talk like that? Keep performing and whining like this, and when arbitration comes up you’ll be very lucky to play in an independent league or in Japan.

    I think that is grounds for him to be made fun of by Mac like Dan Kolb was, Keith Lockhart was, and others before him. Looking forward to that, Mac!


  56. Chief, I don’t think there’s anyone here who doesn’t know your position. I won’t say another word about it and am happy to just continue scrolling right past the vast majority of your posts, but I thought I’d let you know in case you consider typing the same thing over and over and over to people who’ve already read it a waste of your time.

  57. im just trying to look at this in a positive light.
    There is no reason we couldnt make a playoff push.

    If Chipper is healthy the second half, and Tex gets hot. We have a shot. Cause McCann is going to be consistent, and KJ is ok, Esco is ok. We have a decent pen, and some depth pitching. And no one is running away with the division.

    As for Frenchy, I am giving him the benefit of the doubt. He is an upset kid.

  58. I expect a drop-off from McCann sooner rather than later. Our incompetent back-up has created an even-larger-than-normal workload for Heap in the first half.

  59. I sincerely hope that Frenchy gets it together and can contribute. I don’t mind him being a little hurt, though. I wish he’d realize just how much he’s kicked Braves fans in the nuts this year.

  60. I agree, Stu, I think he’s worn out. He puts a lot of pressure on himself, and with how much he plays, he can’t keep carrying on like he has. I can’t see this team making the playoffs, but a decent second half would life my spirits.

  61. It disappoints me to see so many Braves fans acting like spoiled Yankees or Mets fans. I think it is pretty shameful to send Francoeur down like this. I don’t blame him at all for being upset at the demotion, if I were in his position I’d be really pissed at the way it was handled. Guys struggle at the plate all the time, what was different about it this time. The Braves overall have a problem with getting runners in, not just Jeff. I have not been impressed with any move Frank Wren has made so far, except for getting JJ, although I would rather still have Renteria than Escobar. This is a sad day for a once classy organization.

  62. He said Thursday’s conversation, “which lasted maybe five minutes”, came as a surprise to him after playing nearly every day for three seasons.

    It is true that maybe Bobby should have benched him more in the past few weeks than he did. I think Jeff has a valid point. Of course, other veterans have been sent to the minors this year, so it’s not like this was unprecidented. I do hope, though, that his attitude changes after he gets over the raw emotion of this. Maybe that’s why early reports of the move had a quote from his agent saying she told him to turn his cell phone off, aka, not to talk to the media. You don’t want to say something in the heat of the moment that you’ll regret later.

  63. Okay, Todd, what would you have done with an OF who is hitting .234/.287/.374 with an OPS+ of 76 and is 4th in the league in outs? Keep running him out there where he’s had nearly half a season and not gotten better, or put him on the bench where he’s not going to get any better? At what point do you owe the team a chance to win by putting nearly anyone else in that can outperform him?

  64. If he didn’t see this coming, it’s his own fault. This move was telegraphed by the organization and their surrogates for several days, at least.

    Plus, they let him choose where he wanted to go (according to Rodgers). Sounds like they tried to make it as easy for him as possible.

  65. Todd @ 80,
    With all due respect, I couldn’t disagree with you more about the Francoeur situation. He’s never been that good offensively, save for the first 2 months of his ML career. In 2006 he sucked and in 2007 he was servicable, but the difference is he was actually pretty good when runners were on base in 06 & 07….this year he sucks. Just plain sucks. And if it’s not “classy” to care more about winning than marketing, fan response & hurt feelings…then call me white trash buddy.

  66. Not exactly a major revelation, but the worst thing that happened to JF is that hot start. It would have been better for his long term prospects if he had struggled out of the gate. Then he and the team would have realized that he had more work to do to become a quality major leaguer, which is painfully obvious to anyone who cares to look now.

    It’s not surprising that he was hurt by the demotion. He’s obviously a highly competitive guy. However, he should have had the sense to keep his mouth shut to the press, it only makes you look bad in the end.

    I like JF as an individual based on the limited exposure I have as a fan of the team. Seems basically like a good kid. But I’m not optimistic on his long term chances for success. Maybe he’ll see the light and change his approach at the plate. But somehow I doubt it.

  67. What would I have done? Easy, been more patient, perhaps give him more time off and allow him to work through it. I know that bothers some people, but it’s worked well for the Braves in the past. I can’t remember the last time a player with at least 2 years under his belt has been demoted like this. I just think he’s earned enough respect to be given more of a chance. It’s like Chipper said about hitting .400, he probably won’t since he’s a career .330 hitter. Well, Jeff is not a career .230 hitter, so why do you think he’s lost the ability to play better? Slumps happen in baseball even to the best of the players. I think it was Chip on TV the other day that said Joe Dimaggio was something like 9 for 60 before he went on his 56 game hitting streak.

    As far as putting someone else out there who can outperform him, who is that? An unproven call-up in a high pressure situation? Why not allow someone to split time with him to see if someone else can earn the position?

    And yeah, I guess I’m just not a win at all costs kind of guy. If I were, I’d root for the Yankees who spend twice as much as any other team and panic when they don’t win every game. Was John Smoltz dominating in his first couple of years? How about Glavine? No, they were all given time to get better. I’d rather they trade Francoeur instead of this slap in the face kind of move.

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